Page 2 of 7 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 60 of 194

Thread: Are pesticides a good idea?

  1. #31
    Senior Member Cowabunga's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ceredigion, West Wales
    Posts
    1,221

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Is there a shortage or a danger of shortage of such beasties? Bees have died wholesale lately but it has nothing to do with pesticide as they have been decimated by the last eighteen months of weather, especially the last few months, along with that veroa thing that has killed them worldwide.

    Far more potent and less discriminate pesticides than are currently used have been used widely and regularly for nearly a century and there is no real downside while food production has, partly as a result of their use, has multiplied tenfold or more per unit of area, especially in areas that formerly would not grow crops at all due to pests.

    When a problem occurs and if it occurs, farmers and the industry always adapt to minimise or work around the problem in the light of evidence and experience.
    The Duck 2015

  2. #32
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    orkney
    Posts
    152

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Mr.Bunga,

    Your confidence in the way things are going might be inspiring, if it were right.

    Neonicotinoids are currently the most widely used insecticides worldwide,and increasing the whole time. Bayer make about 6 Billion/year from them.

    They build up in our soils,kill a wide range of bugs outside of target species, and yes they are very user-friendly(every seed nicely coated).
    This stuff will rear up and bite us.

    Bayer will thrive......Will we?

    (It's varroa mites,by the way, and it's quite possible that neonics,as they disable bees' grooming ability, make them less able to deal with these parasites).
    Last edited by jaliptrot; 19-04-13 at 02:54 AM.

  3. #33
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    orkney
    Posts
    152

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by foxbox View Post
    Nice provocative post, well done!

    I'm sure someone will bite at some point although you are starting to sound like a walking advert for green activism rather than a farmer.
    Can't I be both?

    Shouldn't we all?

  4. #34
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    189

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by WillyScale View Post
    My point is that you come into contact with toxicities every day. Spilling a bit of strimmer petrol is potentially carcinogenic. Running a tractor in the shed could give you lung trouble. Bleach kills lots of good things as well as "bad things". Alcohol is almost always bad for the liver. Pesticides are one of a range of things that can have a positive or negative effect depending how they are used. As ever the toxicity is the dose and this is often lost on people. So everything can be safe or unsafe depending how and how much are applied.

    I think its not sensible to emote over and fetishize agricultural chemicals as if they are "bad". They are what they are. Cars kill badger, pyrethoid kills insects - do we ban cars?
    I agree that most chemical are safe and been tested so as individual chemicals. BUT as a cocktail there is no way they can be all tested, hence the reason to consume organic food which doesn't pose this risk!
    Perhaps the example of banning cars to save badgers wasn't the best one to use on a farmer in a Btb ares lol

    Jaliptrot makes an excellent point about chemicals being non selective....that his point it kills both good and bad insects same as antibiotics!

  5. #35
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    160

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaliptrot View Post
    I would say that if we carry on using systemic,broad-spectrum ,residual pesticides on millions of acres of OSR,maize, wheat,beans,sunflower,cotton,almonds,etc. throughout the world, we will kill off whole swathes of insects good and 'bad'.
    This will have severe repercussions: reduction of pollinators(quite important), nothing to break down dung in the field, fewer worms etc. to sort out our soil. Reduced insects means fewer birds, less biodiversity in general. We bugger up our ecosystem at our peril.
    We may be pretty clever, but maybe not clever enough to quickly substitute for a web that has been millions of years in the making.
    The global companies pushing these products and systems have only their share holders to satisfy. I don't trust such a limited perspective. They don't have an acceptable long-term alternative to working alongside the established natural world.
    Do you really trust them to replace bees,worms,birds,ladybirds,dung beetles?
    I agree that our high input annual cropping techniques much of which goes into to feed animals or biofuel plants have a lot of negatives. But I do think it is key to sort out some pesticides from others. We buggered up our ecosystem a few times using organic techniques a few times as well (read David Montgomerys Dirt) so I think its not a pesticides bad/organic good argument really.

    When you plough an organic farm for corn you do all manner of damage to the soil, in fact when you harvest a combinable crop you do all manner of damage to birds (you've taken away their winter larder!) but my point is pesticides are tools and can be overapplied and misapplied, the balance will not always be right in the same way on your acres you will not always get the balance right.

  6. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    160

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sid View Post
    I agree that most chemical are safe and been tested so as individual chemicals. BUT as a cocktail there is no way they can be all tested, hence the reason to consume organic food which doesn't pose this risk!
    Perhaps the example of banning cars to save badgers wasn't the best one to use on a farmer in a Btb ares lol

    Jaliptrot makes an excellent point about chemicals being non selective....that his point it kills both good and bad insects same as antibiotics!
    Its not about whether they are safe or not. Its about whether their safe at a certain dose. Water will kill you if you have too much, as will salt as would paraquat. But one = 200l and one is 5ml.

    And I'm listening to the argument about cocktails but I really can't find a lot of evidence for it at the moment. Its possible the research hasn't been done but certainly there are no particular indicators that cocktails of chemicals pose any risk. Some people may be more susceptible than others though.

  7. #37
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    160

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaliptrot View Post
    Can't I be both?

    Shouldn't we all?
    Yes. As long as being green doesn't mean a set of off the shelf views that a lot of people in the eco-activism sphere use which lack ecological perspective.

  8. #38
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    189

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by WillyScale View Post
    Its not about whether they are safe or not. Its about whether their safe at a certain dose. Water will kill you if you have too much, as will salt as would paraquat. But one = 200l and one is 5ml.

    And I'm listening to the argument about cocktails but I really can't find a lot of evidence for it at the moment. Its possible the research hasn't been done but certainly there are no particular indicators that cocktails of chemicals pose any risk. Some people may be more susceptible than others though.
    You simply can't test all the possible mixtures thats why its not done. eat a average apple with x residue on it then eat 200 grams of beef with antibiotic residue, whats the effect on the body after 2 years? Dunno not been tested and results published, maybe the guy that was buried in London last week aged 40 did but we'll never know. Extreme but true. Maybe if he'd eaten 175 grams he would have been ok?
    True about safety, a shotgun is safe when its not loaded! Unless you beat someone with it of course! It is the cocktail effect I worry about TBH

  9. #39
    Senior Member Cowabunga's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ceredigion, West Wales
    Posts
    1,221

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    We are all doomed! We actually all got killed off during the 1960's and 70's when massively more and more toxic chemicals were applied than is the case today. We don't actually exist and are just part of a big computer program simulation.

    Millions of people living longer lives than ever before is just a subtle tweak to the program. All the clean cheap safe food is also a fantasy. It is all toxic and all crop virtual crop production will fail within the next couple of years due to bees, worms, insects, birds and animals being killed off by virtual soil toxicity.

    DOOMED I TELL YOU!!!
    The Duck 2015

  10. #40
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    shropshire
    Posts
    189

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sid View Post
    You simply can't test all the possible mixtures thats why its not done. eat a average apple with x residue on it then eat 200 grams of beef with antibiotic residue, whats the effect on the body after 2 years? Dunno not been tested and results published, maybe the guy that was buried in London last week aged 40 did but we'll never know. Extreme but true. Maybe if he'd eaten 175 grams he would have been ok?
    True about safety, a shotgun is safe when its not loaded! Unless you beat someone with it of course! It is the cocktail effect I worry about TBH
    I am a conventional beef farmer with 100+ suckler cows and I can happily say that only one of the bulls and Heifers that I have sold this year has needed antibiotic. In fact the only injections the rest of my young stock have had is for the TB test. My cows get rotavac because I have rotavirus problems, but unless individual problems occur that is it. Does this make my animals any less safe than organic? Of course not, its a total nonsense!

  11. #41
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    189

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by stu b View Post
    I am a conventional beef farmer with 100+ suckler cows and I can happily say that only one of the bulls and Heifers that I have sold this year has needed antibiotic. In fact the only injections the rest of my young stock have had is for the TB test. My cows get rotavac because I have rotavirus problems, but unless individual problems occur that is it. Does this make my animals any less safe than organic? Of course not, its a total nonsense!
    So why not go organic and reap the premium? Seems nonsense not too???

  12. #42
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Somerset
    Posts
    2,820

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Lol, never seen such a classic post on BFF for years.

    Of course, agchems are only put on for fun these days, probably don't need them, waste of time the lot of it.....





    I can point you in the direction of an organic farm which is constantly over-run with docks and wild oats and other crap. I can't see anything more pointless.

    Good luck trying to stop Wireworm, even with green bridge destruction. They have a 4-5 year life cycle. I've got fields which are still being hammered each spring by them and they are 5 years out of grass.

  13. #43
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Derbyshire
    Posts
    60

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    There is a couple of organic farms near me. It worked for a few years. Now they regularly spray and fertilise at night.

  14. #44
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    160

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sid View Post
    You simply can't test all the possible mixtures thats why its not done. eat a average apple with x residue on it then eat 200 grams of beef with antibiotic residue, whats the effect on the body after 2 years? Dunno not been tested and results published, maybe the guy that was buried in London last week aged 40 did but we'll never know. Extreme but true. Maybe if he'd eaten 175 grams he would have been ok?
    True about safety, a shotgun is safe when its not loaded! Unless you beat someone with it of course! It is the cocktail effect I worry about TBH
    But there no real evidence that the cocktail affect a. exists and b. is bad for you. I would expect at least some evidence from farmers and spray operators who are at the front line but there is nothing of much signifigance worldwide although there are some who clearly suffer.

    So all we have is from you is conjecture and gut feeling. Its not enough of a reason for me yet I'm sorry, I think you have to be as rational as possible.

    Do you drink alcohol by any chance? You do know how many people it kills each year? Should we ban it?

  15. #45
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    65

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaliptrot View Post
    We farmers are responsible for a lot of land. Many of us treat our crops against insects. Why?

    The system we all work with depends on insects, worms,beetles,bacteria, fungi, to remain productive.
    The only clever way for us to work is to understand the happy balances, and not to try to kill every last living thing in our fields.

    Yes, I'm an old hippie organic farmer living out in the wild north.But I am right.I have made a living on 150 acres of west shore land in Orkney for over 30 years.
    Why do any of you really have to sow pesticide-treated seeds or spray against leatherjackets or pollen beetles?

    You should think before you kill the system you rely on.
    Its like comparing apples and pears... If we all were so happy about feeding lesspeople on there land by not bothering about pest damage and letting the land become unproductive and just keep a few livestock running around we would 1) have devastating amounts of starving people in the world, and 2) wouldn't be able to pay our rents, feed our children, keep a roof over our head etc etc.... dont suppose you have to cover much in the way of rent up there do you? If you do by charging a premium for a niche product then we cant all do it and charge a premium. People cant afford the premium payed for organic innefficiencies now... organic farmers cant afford it either and are having to turn conventional to survive.

    I you cant see these points above after 30 years and come on here preaching to farmers to think when they are thinking then you are going to be taken with as much respect as any other fairy thinking lifestyle greeny/activist/a little bit of knowledge is dangerous etc etc person.

    Also, while i'm on can people stop referring to problems other climates, soil types, local scenarios have and then blanket generalising the doom it will cause to our area when we dont have much if any of the same problems!! My soil is not being blown away!

    By the way my 200 acres have never used an insectiside but i will use a herbicide as soon as my creeping nettle is ready to spray as a whole farm of creeping nettles isnt going to produce much food for people nor pay my bills.

    Just how do you make a living so we can see were we are going wrong... whats your rent?, output?, market we can all get into?, do you have any overheads? Do you pay 200/300 pound an acre rent that can be a killer sometimes?

  16. #46
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    160

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by jackson4 View Post
    Its like comparing apples and pears... If we all were so happy about feeding lesspeople on there land by not bothering about pest damage and letting the land become unproductive and just keep a few livestock running around we would 1) have devastating amounts of starving people in the world, and 2) wouldn't be able to pay our rents, feed our children, keep a roof over our head etc etc.... dont suppose you have to cover much in the way of rent up there do you? If you do by charging a premium for a niche product then we cant all do it and charge a premium. People cant afford the premium payed for organic innefficiencies now... organic farmers cant afford it either and are having to turn conventional to survive.

    I you cant see these points above after 30 years and come on here preaching to farmers to think when they are thinking then you are going to be taken with as much respect as any other fairy thinking lifestyle greeny/activist/a little bit of knowledge is dangerous etc etc person.

    Also, while i'm on can people stop referring to problems other climates, soil types, local scenarios have and then blanket generalising the doom it will cause to our area when we dont have much if any of the same problems!! My soil is not being blown away!

    By the way my 200 acres have never used an insectiside but i will use a herbicide as soon as my creeping nettle is ready to spray as a whole farm of creeping nettles isnt going to produce much food for people nor pay my bills.

    Just how do you make a living so we can see were we are going wrong... whats your rent?, output?, market we can all get into?, do you have any overheads? Do you pay 200/300 pound an acre rent that can be a killer sometimes?
    Lots of soils have lost serious amounts of OM in the UK in the past 50 years. It is a serious issue. Because it so gradual its not noticed or valued by some.

    Also we do clearly have issue with N and P run off and with soil erosion and in increasing areas.

  17. #47
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Somerset
    Posts
    2,820

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Of course Will, but then they won't listen over in the East, and continue to do the WW and OSR rotation, and we know the wheels are gradually falling off. Everyone knows that grand father farmed in a certain way for a reason.

  18. #48
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    orkney
    Posts
    152

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by jackson4 View Post
    Its like comparing apples and pears... If we all were so happy about feeding lesspeople on there land by not bothering about pest damage and letting the land become unproductive and just keep a few livestock running around we would 1) have devastating amounts of starving people in the world, and 2) wouldn't be able to pay our rents, feed our children, keep a roof over our head etc etc.... dont suppose you have to cover much in the way of rent up there do you? If you do by charging a premium for a niche product then we cant all do it and charge a premium. People cant afford the premium payed for organic innefficiencies now... organic farmers cant afford it either and are having to turn conventional to survive.

    I you cant see these points above after 30 years and come on here preaching to farmers to think when they are thinking then you are going to be taken with as much respect as any other fairy thinking lifestyle greeny/activist/a little bit of knowledge is dangerous etc etc person.

    Also, while i'm on can people stop referring to problems other climates, soil types, local scenarios have and then blanket generalising the doom it will cause to our area when we dont have much if any of the same problems!! My soil is not being blown away!

    By the way my 200 acres have never used an insectiside but i will use a herbicide as soon as my creeping nettle is ready to spray as a whole farm of creeping nettles isnt going to produce much food for people nor pay my bills.

    Just how do you make a living so we can see were we are going wrong... whats your rent?, output?, market we can all get into?, do you have any overheads? Do you pay 200/300 pound an acre rent that can be a killer sometimes?
    Didn't mean to preach,sorry, just pose a question or two...
    The point I am making is that there is now,with many crops,a default system of treating the seed with a broad-spectrum pesticide which can kill immediately, or with a delayed effect,most insects which come into contact wih it, whether or not they are harmful to the crop. I imagine this is not really what farmers would wish to do,but it is what is going on.
    That's why I put the question.
    As for me,I farmed conventionally on this 150 acre west coast Orkney sheep and beef business for about 20 years. I changed to Organic 12 years ago. I now produce more lambs than before ,they make about 100 each, and am pretty self contained - closed flock and herd of Highlands,grow all my own cereals and winter keep. I am happy with the way the place is going so am fairly confident to speak about it.
    No,I don't pay rent,except for 30 acres which I get fairly cheap because people like their fields to be rented by an organic farmer(some people are like that).
    Last edited by jaliptrot; 20-04-13 at 05:24 PM.

  19. #49
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Midlands
    Posts
    209

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    Of course Will, but then they won't listen over in the East, and continue to do the WW and OSR rotation, and we know the wheels are gradually falling off. Everyone knows that grand father farmed in a certain way for a reason.
    The area in the UK down to WW/OSR is diddly squat compared to the millions of acres in the US which are down to Maize/Soya, or the acres in Australia which are continuous wheat.

    GM crops are resistant to specific pests, reducing the pesticide requirement. Seems very logical to me but the EU disagree. It'll come though, dont you worry. Economics always wins.

  20. #50
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    orkney
    Posts
    152

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Condi View Post
    The area in the UK down to WW/OSR is diddly squat compared to the millions of acres in the US which are down to Maize/Soya, or the acres in Australia which are continuous wheat.

    GM crops are resistant to specific pests, reducing the pesticide requirement. Seems very logical to me but the EU disagree. It'll come though, dont you worry. Economics always wins.
    Economics is often based on short-term gains. Farming has to look at the longer term stuff.
    Kill off the insects and we're stuffed.

  21. #51
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Midlands
    Posts
    209

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    You've missed the point of my post.

    GM pest resistant crops dont need pesticides because they naturally repel the insect. Its not about killing them off, but preventing from them infecting crops in the first place. There will always be a natural background number of pests anyway, but much better for them to be in wasteland, forests etc rather than food crops. Only 5% of the worlds land area is used for farming, so its not as if they have nowhere to live peacefully.

  22. #52
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    orkney
    Posts
    152

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Condi View Post
    You've missed the point of my post.

    GM pest resistant crops dont need pesticides because they naturally repel the insect. Its not about killing them off, but preventing from them infecting crops in the first place. There will always be a natural background number of pests anyway, but much better for them to be in wasteland, forests etc rather than food crops. Only 5% of the worlds land area is used for farming, so its not as if they have nowhere to live peacefully.
    O.K.I don't claim to know the ins and outs of GM pest-resisistant crops. I would be interested for you to tell us how they work. The idea that they simply repel insects/pests with no unintended consequences sounds attractive, but I would be suprised if it's as simple as that.

  23. #53
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    617

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    It has been a long, convoluted argument, right until GM was mentioned.

    SIMPLES!

    GM enables the plant to protect itself.

    Never liked the word PESTICIDE anyway, although by some miraculous means they do seem to have got rid of the food rationing of my youth.

    Jack Caley

  24. #54
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    orkney
    Posts
    152

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    It has been a long, convoluted argument, right until GM was mentioned.

    SIMPLES!

    GM enables the plant to protect itself.

    Never liked the word PESTICIDE anyway, although by some miraculous means they do seem to have got rid of the food rationing of my youth.

    Jack Caley
    You're convinced GM is the way to go?
    Tell us why.With what evidence.

  25. #55
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    189

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    Lol, never seen such a classic post on BFF for years.

    Of course, agchems are only put on for fun these days, probably don't need them, waste of time the lot of it.....





    I can point you in the direction of an organic farm which is constantly over-run with docks and wild oats and other crap. I can't see anything more pointless.

    Good luck trying to stop Wireworm, even with green bridge destruction. They have a 4-5 year life cycle. I've got fields which are still being hammered each spring by them and they are 5 years out of grass.
    I can point you to a conventional farmer who's farm is covered in docks, thistles and sheep scab. Perhaps GM farming would help him? I've seen another in a similar suituation covered in weeds taken over by an organic famrer and you'd never know it was the same place, and no he didn't spray it off before converting it!

    Quote Originally Posted by Grassman View Post
    There is a couple of organic farms near me. It worked for a few years. Now they regularly spray and fertilise at night.
    Yeah right, if its true then report them or pm me their details and I will. I want to look after my premium and the integrety of my product

    Quote Originally Posted by WillyScale View Post
    But there no real evidence that the cocktail affect a. exists and b. is bad for you. I would expect at least some evidence from farmers and spray operators who are at the front line but there is nothing of much signifigance worldwide although there are some who clearly suffer.

    So all we have is from you is conjecture and gut feeling. Its not enough of a reason for me yet I'm sorry, I think you have to be as rational as possible.

    Do you drink alcohol by any chance? You do know how many people it kills each year? Should we ban it?
    There is also no real evidence that it doesn't have an effect either so catch 22?
    Alcohol is banned in some countries!

  26. #56
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    584

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cowabunga View Post
    Stop being such a tiresome Troll, there's a good chap and grow up whatever your true age.
    Leave him alone ducky he has as much of a valid point as you, stop being a Internet bully and stop accusing members of being trolling as it is pathetic and if there ever was a troll it would be you !

  27. #57
    Senior Member ladycrofter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Highlands
    Posts
    661

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Condi View Post
    You've missed the point of my post. GM pest resistant crops dont need pesticides because they naturally repel the insect.
    Let us not forget the recoverative power of nature. IIRC frogs and some other creatures can change the sex of their offspring, and some can even change themselves from male to female in adulthood (a species fish I think?)

    So this is the worrying thing about GM products. In principle it seems a good idea and a natural progression from our previously scientifically-driven but otherwise hamfisted approach to selective breeding - put two things together and see what comes out. Red flowers + white flowers = pink flowers.

    But not always, and this is the problem with GM. We presume that because have have bred, in this case, a plant that repels a certain pest, that it will continue to do so, and the pest will not evolve (and often quite quickly) to resist it. This is the arrogance of GM - that because we have created an ANSWER in the laboratory, that this answer will always hold true and thay we have somehow out-smarted nature. Surely we all remember from school that a small percentage of cockroaches can tolerate enough radiation to nearly vaporise a rock? This is my issue with GM - nothing is 100% in the first place (just look at the problem we have with wormers now).

    It has always been a on-going battle to produce food without destroying the environment, but I fear the the GM scientists, because they are quick-fix and profit-driven, will not, and I think we can safely say, do not, consider the long term, beyond the next share-holders' meeting.

    Someday I fear, everything we grow will be GM, including the flowers in our garden, because we crave perfection. After all, when was the last time you opened a gardening magazine and saw a picture of a spotty apple or slightly black-spotty rose? What will the insects feed on then? Or will we just be left with cockroaches?

  28. #58
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    160

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sid View Post


    There is also no real evidence that it doesn't have an effect either so catch 22?
    Alcohol is banned in some countries!
    But all new pesticides are heavily monitored and tested for human health. This cocktail thing is conjecture. I'm interested to read any meaningful data on it but I'm not sure its a strong enough basis to say no one should consume any food with pesticides on it. In fact I'd expect farmers and their families to be at the front line statistically of any patterns.

    I think the risks to continuity of supply of food products outweighs any speculative concerns on cocktails effects at the moment. But that said I wouldn't be upset if neonicotonids went because I'm not particularly sure about them.

  29. #59
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    189

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by WillyScale View Post
    But all new pesticides are heavily monitored and tested for human health. This cocktail thing is conjecture. I'm interested to read any meaningful data on it but I'm not sure its a strong enough basis to say no one should consume any food with pesticides on it. In fact I'd expect farmers and their families to be at the front line statistically of any patterns.

    I think the risks to continuity of supply of food products outweighs any speculative concerns on cocktails effects at the moment. But that said I wouldn't be upset if neonicotonids went because I'm not particularly sure about them.
    OP sheep dip, documented facts that dippers were affected, but nothing 100% proven. BSE crossing to humans...can't be proven 100%, Johnes passing to humans, not clear at the momment.
    People that wish to eat organic do so for many reasons one of those being chemical residues and there effects. Thats there choice to speculate. They have a choice and lucky to have one!

  30. #60
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Somerset
    Posts
    2,820

    Re: Are pesticides a good idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sid View Post
    OP sheep dip, documented facts that dippers were affected, but nothing 100% proven. BSE crossing to humans...can't be proven 100%, Johnes passing to humans, not clear at the momment.
    People that wish to eat organic do so for many reasons one of those being chemical residues and there effects. Thats there choice to speculate. They have a choice and lucky to have one!
    Naughty; you insinuate that BSE ,Johnes, are somehow a problem limited to the conventional farming camp. This is not the case.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •