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Thread: Do I buy a Round Baler

  1. #1
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    Do I buy a Round Baler

    Going to do a few more round bales this year Silage and Hay.
    Will Probably do between 5 and 600.
    Is this enough to justify a New Baler and Wrapper circa 22000.
    I value being in charge of my own destiny and would place a value on that. I do have a very good reliable contractor who presently does it for me but at the end of the season I end up with a bill and nothing else. Perhaps this is good as I know exactly where I am . Have not had a price for this years baling and wrapping this year has anybody heard any rates ?
    Tia
    A

  2. #2
    Senior Member b slicker's Avatar
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Why do you want to buy new? You should be able to buy a good second hand baler and wrapper for less than 8000.

    At an annual cost of 1600 (20% of purchase price) the cost/bale for 800 bales would be 2. Even if you only bale 500 bales, the cost/bale of 3 would still compare with what your contractor would charge. And the additional cost of having to use your own tractor would be offset by the convenience of being able to do the job as and when it suits you.

    But spending 22,000 on new tackle would be a non starter.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Wellies's Avatar
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Nowhere near enough bales to justify 22k.
    I only make around 200 bales per year and I cant really justify my 700 baler & 500 wrapper, but like you I like being able to do it when I want and without relying on anyone.
    Best advice is work out all the running costs and see how it compares to contractor prices. Amazes me that contractors get by when you work out the price of diesel and wrap alone.

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    As already said financialy 600 bales wouldn't justify buying new kit, second hand could be worth it though or even just a baler and get your contractor to just do the wrapping, waiting on a contractor when you have hay ready to bale and rain forecast is no fun! silage isn't going to spoil if its already baled and gets a shower of rain before being wrapped if the contractor gets held up on another job

  5. #5
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    I'd save the money and maybe get a tedder/rake instead. Let a contractor come and mow and get a fusion or something on the job. Work with a contractor who will definitely be there for you when you need him.

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    If you can afford it who do you have to justify it to, I probably can't justify much of anything I have here now but who cares? If you can buy 'right' second hand you will probably always be able to get back what you paid for it in the next few years or even make a little, better than having nothing to show for it. New seems a bit costly for the work it would do, but it should last many years and should mean no large repair bills for years. One of the worst things I have done is to keep paying the contractor for another two or three years and then decide to buy the new gear at which point it would be a few k more, and even less affordable.

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Do you have the time?

  8. #8
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Nice to do what you want when you want.
    Always waiting all the bloody time otherwise for them, and only one field to do they say when they actually got 5 fields yo do.
    If you cant bale hay between 2pm and 6pm waist of time.

  9. #9
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Thanks for all the replies.
    First why new, i am an awful mechanic and new has attractive finance package and 2 years warranty worth quite a bit to me..
    2nd Hand kit is cheaper and has taken the hit but new would probably last me 15 years if looked after.
    Time probably not but it is 6 mnths feed so needs to be done to best of ability.
    Got the Rake and Mower Tedder I would have to buy.
    Buying just the baler good point will give it some thought.
    Thankyou to all for the help. Time for some more thinking.
    @

  10. #10

    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by AntiNFU View Post
    Thanks for all the replies.
    First why new, i am an awful mechanic and new has attractive finance package and 2 years warranty worth quite a bit to me..
    2nd Hand kit is cheaper and has taken the hit but new would probably last me 15 years if looked after.
    Time probably not but it is 6 mnths feed so needs to be done to best of ability.
    Got the Rake and Mower Tedder I would have to buy.
    Buying just the baler good point will give it some thought.
    Thankyou to all for the help. Time for some more thinking.
    @
    If you're an awful mechanic, then contractors are the best option for you.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Clive Tee's Avatar
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by AntiNFU View Post
    Going to do a few more round bales this year Silage and Hay.
    Will Probably do between 5 and 600.
    Is this enough to justify a New Baler and Wrapper circa 22000.
    I value being in charge of my own destiny and would place a value on that. I do have a very good reliable contractor who presently does it for me but at the end of the season I end up with a bill and nothing else. Perhaps this is good as I know exactly where I am . Have not had a price for this years baling and wrapping this year has anybody heard any rates ?
    Tia
    A
    If you've got income you can charge the 22k against, you can buy this and put it 100% against tax. Eases the pain .
    Clive Tee

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    0% , deferred payments, years, all offers with new, but still expensive, plus diesel,, tractor driver, net wrap, etc.etc?

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    Senior Member b slicker's Avatar
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by Clive Tee View Post
    If you've got income you can charge the 22k against, you can buy this and put it 100% against tax. Eases the pain .
    Sorry Clive, all that happens is that the pain is delayed for a year. That's because - if you claim 100% of machinery purchases against tax this year there will be nothing left to claim next year, so you end up paying far more tax next year.

    You just can't win.

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by AntiNFU View Post
    Going to do a few more round bales this year Silage and Hay.
    Will Probably do between 5 and 600.
    Is this enough to justify a New Baler and Wrapper circa 22000.
    I value being in charge of my own destiny and would place a value on that. I do have a very good reliable contractor who presently does it for me but at the end of the season I end up with a bill and nothing else. Perhaps this is good as I know exactly where I am . Have not had a price for this years baling and wrapping this year has anybody heard any rates ?
    Tia
    A
    Haved you priced machines? I don't think you'll get both new for 22k any baler alone will be 22k plus I rekon.

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Is buying the baler and relying on somebody to come in and wrap a good idea. What if you bale and he's stuck wrapping bales elsewhere, maybe for a customer who has him baling as well? I'd make friends with a mechanical farmer and perhaps scout around for somebody to share with. But would say that if you're gonna bale you should do the wrapping as well.
    Bright ideas for successful farming www.farmideas.co.uk

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    You have not told us your circumstances, and nor need you do so, but if you can afford it and want to do it, you will probably only regret the move the day you write out the cheque. Few things can be justified on paper, but money is worth nothing in the bank and you cannot save fast enough to buy land, so why not make your job enjoyable. Dealers' second-hand looks piss-taking dear when you can get 0% over 3 yrs, and play hardball to price new.
    However, if you are a one man band, you will have to buy a trailed wrapper and wrap in field, or you will need a third party to lead the bales to the stack for you to wrap them, if you are to achieve much better than 60 or 80 bales baled, wrapped and stacked in a long day, if you have to cart them any distance at all. Especially so if you have to row up after the dew has gone, before you can start baling.

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by David. View Post
    You have not told us your circumstances, and nor need you do so, but if you can afford it and want to do it, you will probably only regret the move the day you write out the cheque. Few things can be justified on paper, but money is worth nothing in the bank and you cannot save fast enough to buy land, so why not make your job enjoyable. Dealers' second-hand looks piss-taking dear when you can get 0% over 3 yrs, and play hardball to price new.
    However, if you are a one man band, you will have to buy a trailed wrapper and wrap in field, or you will need a third party to lead the bales to the stack for you to wrap them, if you are to achieve much better than 60 or 80 bales baled, wrapped and stacked in a long day, if you have to cart them any distance at all. Especially so if you have to row up after the dew has gone, before you can start baling.

    The big advantage is being able to go when you want to, but and the big but is you will be MUCH slower. That has two consequences one stress, implements off and on, potential problems and lack of backup. Two while you can go when you want you can't take advantage of limited weather window in the same way as you cant rake, bale and wrap the same time. You might be limited to 10 acre a time.

    The weather and time will be your enemy so you will need the biggest and shiniest kit you can get.

    If you need the forage for a commercial operation you can't afford problems. Put the money in the bank it will get you 500 quid a year and buy some property which will be paid down in 15 years long after your shiney baler is scrap earning you a nice pension.

    if you need to satisfy the 'urge' buy an old baler and set assist 10 acres for your entertainment.

  18. #18
    Senior Member Clive Tee's Avatar
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by b slicker View Post
    Sorry Clive, all that happens is that the pain is delayed for a year. That's because - if you claim 100% of machinery purchases against tax this year there will be nothing left to claim next year, so you end up paying far more tax next year.
    No, you buy something else next year ,

    or maybe it should be .

    I'm in the same boat as the OP and would love to just do stuff when I want to. But working on my own it would be very difficult, especially when the weather is tight. Last year our contractor came in quickly one afternoon with 2 JD's and 2 McHale baler/wrapper and cleared 300 bales in no time, to avoid a change in the weather. Couldn't do that on my own! I think a lot depends on how good and flexible the OP's contractor is. If ours hadn't done that, I'd be thinking of a baler/wrapper myself.

    Also, he's got 5 balers. If I had one, it would be bound to break down just as I needed it!
    Clive Tee

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by Clive Tee View Post
    No, you buy something else next year ,

    or maybe it should be .

    I'm in the same boat as the OP and would love to just do stuff when I want to. But working on my own it would be very difficult, especially when the weather is tight. Last year our contractor came in quickly one afternoon with 2 JD's and 2 McHale baler/wrapper and cleared 300 bales in no time, to avoid a change in the weather. Couldn't do that on my own! I think a lot depends on how good and flexible the OP's contractor is. If ours hadn't done that, I'd be thinking of a baler/wrapper myself.

    Also, he's got 5 balers. If I had one, it would be bound to break down just as I needed it!
    Cheapish second hand baler and wrapper, is on my wish list, not to do a few hundred bales at a go, nor even 50 for that matter.

    BUT, would be great as a grass management tool. Taking out grass running ahead of demand, during peak growth. 5, 10, 15 bales at a pop or more
    where grass available. Too few to get contractor in. With your own way of taking out bales in this manner, your topper if you have one, becomes obsolete.

    You get good quality winter fodder in the yard, and keep good quality summer grass before your stock. You eliminate topping. Waste of time and diesel.

  20. #20
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by mac956 View Post
    Haved you priced machines? I don't think you'll get both new for 22k any baler alone will be 22k plus I rekon.
    Yes that is the price i have been quoted. In round terms not got down to nitty gritty at all I asked the question how much would I need to spend and was told 15k baler 7k wrapper. As i say this is to give me idea to think about. May be 1k more might be 1k less just needed to know somewhere near to get a feel.

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by farmideas View Post
    Is buying the baler and relying on somebody to come in and wrap a good idea. What if you bale and he's stuck wrapping bales elsewhere, maybe for a customer who has him baling as well? I'd make friends with a mechanical farmer and perhaps scout around for somebody to share with. But would say that if you're gonna bale you should do the wrapping as well.
    Have to agree.

  22. #22
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by David. View Post
    You have not told us your circumstances, and nor need you do so, but if you can afford it and want to do it, you will probably only regret the move the day you write out the cheque. Few things can be justified on paper, but money is worth nothing in the bank and you cannot save fast enough to buy land, so why not make your job enjoyable. Dealers' second-hand looks piss-taking dear when you can get 0% over 3 yrs, and play hardball to price new.
    However, if you are a one man band, you will have to buy a trailed wrapper and wrap in field, or you will need a third party to lead the bales to the stack for you to wrap them, if you are to achieve much better than 60 or 80 bales baled, wrapped and stacked in a long day, if you have to cart them any distance at all. Especially so if you have to row up after the dew has gone, before you can start baling.
    Dairy Farm Father Mother Me Wife and 2 keen kids and 3 others who will help out so got the staff. Got the other kit ie big mower Rake Bale squeezer.Bought extra land not got much if any spare money but would rather pay for kit and have something left than pay contractor every year and nothing left. Have our own forager but do about 250 300 acres in one hit so need extra staff and think maybe with more bales quality would improve ie instead of waiting for one big hit would do it more when it is at optimum quality.

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    for that number cheapest and most flexible is to buy a new or good secondhand baler and bag the bales. a wrapper is not essential and by bagging you do as little or as many as you want when you want

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by Robw54 View Post
    The big advantage is being able to go when you want to, but and the big but is you will be MUCH slower. That has two consequences one stress, implements off and on, potential problems and lack of backup. Two while you can go when you want you can't take advantage of limited weather window in the same way as you cant rake, bale and wrap the same time. You might be limited to 10 acre a time.

    The weather and time will be your enemy so you will need the biggest and shiniest kit you can get.

    If you need the forage for a commercial operation you can't afford problems. Put the money in the bank it will get you 500 quid a year and buy some property which will be paid down in 15 years long after your shiney baler is scrap earning you a nice pension.

    if you need to satisfy the 'urge' buy an old baler and set assist 10 acres for your entertainment.
    Urge is not a problem at all. Id much prefer to watch someone else bale it. Agree shiny kit is probably needed for reliability.

  25. #25
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by WILF View Post
    for that number cheapest and most flexible is to buy a new or good secondhand baler and bag the bales. a wrapper is not essential and by bagging you do as little or as many as you want when you want

    Didn't know you could still get bags! Any links to get them?

  26. #26
    Senior Member ladycrofter's Avatar
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by Thick Farmer View Post
    If you're an awful mechanic, then contractors are the best option for you.
    +1 If you buy second hand you will need to repair something, else why are they selling it?

    We bought 2nd hand JD550 net/wrap. Great machine after OH reduced chain length, freed seized roller brake etc. No much work if you are mechanical but a non-starter if you 1) aren't, or 2) don't have time.

    Hay - you must have your own baler these days IMO the window for baling hay is getting shorter and shorter. Sometimes here, only 1 day you can get it, and you certainly won't get a contractor. They are trying to get their own in.

    Haylage - write a cheque to a contractor. Our guy - 1 pass with moco, two days later bales stacked at the shed. And he has back-up kit if something breaks. You don't.

    BTW buying any round baler does not guarantee that it will bale when you need it to. Check out thread on net wrapping around roller

    one of many in the round baler bag of tricks.

  27. #27
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    I think that there are 2 ways to look at this. 1. can you financially justify the baler and 2. what other non financial benefits can you derive from having your own kit. If you want you can manipulate the figures to almost financially justify anything within reason. We silage around 1100 bales, hay 250 bales and straw 1300 bales and have owned our own baler for years. We usually update every six years or so, although the kit could last longer but often get good offers or upgrade because of tax etc. I have done the sums and can justify what we do (to myself!!), but it is great to have the baler sat in the shed on the tractor ready to go whenever we want especially at harvest and hay times. What cost do you have for being able to nip out before the rain comes and 'save' the crop? Having said that I think that the sums are pretty hard to justify in your situation as our wrapper (Vicon) when new (5 years ago) was 4500, and baler (Vicon, chopper) (3 years ago) was 15000, and as I said I found things hard to justify. I have to agree that a good secondhand chopper baler would easily to a great job for you.

  28. #28
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Not all s/h gear is clapped out or broken, could be genuine retirement or change of farming practices, or of course one could buy from dealer with warranty. Roundbalers are pretty simple overall to keep running a few chains and sprockets, get local spannerman/dealer to give them a pre-season check and it shouldn't give a problem as long as you check over things each day, not the end of the world if you have to stick a joiner in a belt baler or mend a broken chain. I would also think whether I would buy a new cheap baler or a s/h baler that was much much more expensive to begin with, and new depreciated.

  29. #29
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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    In a quandary myself as to how to go about my silage. I have my own kit ( 4 year old welger + kv trailed wrapper ) and worked well when there was two of us. Sadly I'm on my own now and finding some one flexible enough to come and man a machine when I need them is not easy. So I am wondering the same, should I get a contractor to do the wrapping-stacking?

    Another option would be to look for a sh Fusion. My worries with a Fusion are, how it would work on our steeper fields and how it works with straw(I bale more straw than silage). Also is my 6480 man enough for a Fusion?

    More questions than answers, sorry.

    Ross

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    Re: Do I buy a Round Baler

    Quote Originally Posted by Toshak View Post
    Cheapish second hand baler and wrapper, is on my wish list, not to do a few hundred bales at a go, nor even 50 for that matter.

    BUT, would be great as a grass management tool. Taking out grass running ahead of demand, during peak growth. 5, 10, 15 bales at a pop or more
    where grass available. Too few to get contractor in. With your own way of taking out bales in this manner, your topper if you have one, becomes obsolete.

    You get good quality winter fodder in the yard, and keep good quality summer grass before your stock. You eliminate topping. Waste of time and diesel.

    Surely cheapest way to feed that grass remaining is to put some sheep/cattle on it?

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