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Thread: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

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    Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    DO NOT USE hi-speed burst setting !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I did for a couple of months during silage season in 2011. Photos looked fine when viewing on computer screen.

    When I submitted some photos into Classic Tractor magazine, they asked for "full sized photos".

    It turns out that on hi speed burst the size of the photos are reduced dramatically and they cant be used for hi quality prints etc.

    In Auto & most other modes the size of the photos are 3456 x 2592 = high quality photos

    in hi-speed-burst the size of the photos are 1600 x 1200 = low quality


    hi-speed-burst gives faster shutter time, avoids the delay between taking photos but it F**Ks photo quality

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    Senior Member Cowabunga's Avatar
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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    That depends on your camera, it really does. For many cameras the resolution is drastically reduced at higher speeds and you also lose autofocus, which can be important for action shots. But there are plenty of camera out there that can give a choice of burst rates and some can do high or even full resolution at five frames a second or more at full resolution and even retain autofocus in some cases.

    My Sony A57 can shoot full-resolution 16.1 megapixel pictures at up to 12fps whilst maintaining continuous auto focus and auto exposure, an incredibly fast rate for such a relatively inexpensive camera as these things go. To achieve the full 12fps you need to set the exposure mode dial to the dedicated Tele-zoom Continuous Advance Priority AE shooting mode, which locks the exposure at the start of the sequence and uses the 1.4x tele-zoom function to record the center part of the image, resulting in an 8.4 megapixel photo. You can set the aperture and ISO speed by changing to AF-S or Manual focus mode, but you then lose the ability to refocus between frames. The A57 can shoot up to 21 raw files or 18 raw + fine JPEGs in a single 12 frame burst. The slightly slower 10fps option records a full-size 16 megapixel image.

    I've also got an entry level Samsung NX 1000 which has a very good Burst mode which enables you to take 8 frames per second for up to 11 JPEG images at the highest image quality (it has 20.3 megapixels on a massive APS-C sensor) or 8 RAW images. I don't personally bother shooting RAW files. Not yet anyhow.

    You can also choose a slower 3fps rate for 15 JPEGs. There's also a special Burst mode that records 30 frames per second, albeit only at 5 megapixel JPEG resolution, with slower 15 and 10fps options also available which, as you rightly warn, is best avoided for printing or pixel-peeping purposes.

    Burst mode can be very rewarding in that it can capture images that you would normally miss. Another burst feature that is available on some cameras, notably the Nikon1 and some Fuji advanced compacts, is a kind of anticipation burst that starts a burst as soon as you press the shutter button to the first stage and keeps six frames (I think) before you take the shot and six after. Not sure that the technique is quite as I describe it but you probably get the general idea. It is called something like 'Best Frame Capture'.
    Last edited by Cowabunga; 26-06-13 at 10:44 AM.

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    What make and model of camera are you using? I shoot with an Canon EOS 50D and have it on high speed all the time. Photo quality and sizes are the same throughout. So this problem certainly does not apply to everyone!

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    If you'd cut your teeth using a 35mm camera with a 20 exposure roll of film, you wouldn't be wasting your shots using a burst setting!

    Can't help observing how far photography has come. (Or should that be gone?).

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    Quote Originally Posted by Dry Rot View Post
    If you'd cut your teeth using a 35mm camera with a 20 exposure roll of film, you wouldn't be wasting your shots using a burst setting!

    Can't help observing how far photography has come. (Or should that be gone?).
    It is the difference between a pick and shovel and a full spec tracked excavator. Not only that, but they don't need fuel any longer....... no film, developing cost or printing of substandard shots. Easy storage, cataloguing, searching and retrieval that uses no physical space.

    And if you are into the hardware as well, there's never been a wider choice, from the utility and colourful happy-snappers to the really beautifully built and styled photographic instruments. Pentax, in particular, are really putting some effort into style and fashion with their retro brass-capped MX-1 advanced compact and colourful K series and tiny Q series which are available in hundreds of colour combinations.


    Wizzo does specifically title the topic as "Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting".
    "Compact" is a massive class of camera in its own right. His observation is valid for most point and shoot cameras and older cameras but things have changed in a very short time in the camera market. It is an apt and pertinent warning for those that want the best quality pictures from limiting hardware.

    The latest more advanced compact cameras have, basically, 'advanced' features and SLR-type features. If you think about it, the digital camera market barely existed only twelve years ago and started with very basic low res models that were nowhere near competitive in picture terms with film, even in the happy-snappy class. Picture quality hasn't necessarily improved that much in the last three or four years but the capability and adjustability and feature options on cameras has. The point-and-shoot will always be simple automatic jobbies, because there is a demand for them. They are a declining breed though, mainly due to the increasing capability and sophistication of camera phones, which most people carry with them at all times.

    The Pentax Q is worth a look. It is very sophisticated for a tiny camera and the body can be bought new for something like 80. The lenses cost a lot more though. Google 'SRS Pentax' for prices. It is a miniature SLR with a tiny form factor and compact sensor but fully featured. But don't compare it with a system camera or SLR, compare it to compact cameras. It has been drastically reduced in price because they tried selling it at ridiculously high prices to start with and it just didn't sell at that price point. They are now off-loading it at more sensible money, although the lens prices are still scandalous imo. One limitation, or it could be an advantage in some cases, is that due to the small sensor, it has a very deep depth of field, which helps keep everything sharp and in focus but makes de-focussing the background or foreground [or both apart from the subject] almost impossible.

    Anyone interested might want to look at this Olympus model. There is a refurbished one available with two year warranty for sensible money and new ones are not badly priced either. Half the price of the current new model. And it is a proper relatively large micro2/3 camera, which is what the Panasonic GH3 has in a higher spec.
    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Olympus-E-PM...A1FG9Y24GEEG5Z
    Last edited by Cowabunga; 26-06-13 at 02:45 PM.
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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    Oh, I am not a Luddite at all. I have a Nikon D200 which weighs half a tonne and does everything but talk! Just doing some bemusing. I don't think it helps me take better pictures at all. Just more of them that can be manipulated. I've sold a few photos and would never have dreamt of taking more than half a dozen 20 exposure rolls of film with me on a shoot.

    Then there's cine. 100 foot of 16mm film would give you 2.5 minutes and cost 100 to develop and print pre-editing. Then I moved onto video which was ideally a two man job, one to carry the camera and the second to carry the recorder with a 20 minute tape. (I worked alone out of a truck with a long umbilical between recorder and camera!). Now I have a PD150 (obsolete, of course) that shoots better quality (HD) and wide screen onto a 40 minute tape that is edited non-linearly. If the story is good, the quality really isn't that important.

    But are we better photographers for it? Anout the time of the change over to digital, I went on a shoot with my old 35mm Olympus and met some fellow photographers using digital. They said they had each taken over 2,000 "pictures" that day!

    Chain saw and surgeon's scalpel, more like! And here we are discussing how to turn photos from colour to black and white!

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    Quote Originally Posted by Dry Rot View Post
    Oh, I am not a Luddite at all. I have a Nikon D200 which weighs half a tonne and does everything but talk! Just doing some bemusing. I don't think it helps me take better pictures at all. Just more of them that can be manipulated. I've sold a few photos and would never have dreamt of taking more than half a dozen 20 exposure rolls of film with me on a shoot.

    Then there's cine. 100 foot of 16mm film would give you 2.5 minutes and cost 100 to develop and print pre-editing. Then I moved onto video which was ideally a two man job, one to carry the camera and the second to carry the recorder with a 20 minute tape. (I worked alone out of a truck with a long umbilical between recorder and camera!). Now I have a PD150 (obsolete, of course) that shoots better quality (HD) and wide screen onto a 40 minute tape that is edited non-linearly. If the story is good, the quality really isn't that important.

    But are we better photographers for it? Anout the time of the change over to digital, I went on a shoot with my old 35mm Olympus and met some fellow photographers using digital. They said they had each taken over 2,000 "pictures" that day!

    Chain saw and surgeon's scalpel, more like! And here we are discussing how to turn photos from colour to black and white!
    2000 photos in a day! Now that is being happy-snappy on speed.:-)

    Really, don't you appreciate the convenience and improvent made available by things like being able to change from color to monochrome in an instant either as you shoot or afterwards rather than having to finish a roll of film and change it for another roll of monochrome for another fixed number of shots? Or are you, despite your claim, really a Luddite or even a masochist? :-) :-)

    But you are correct in that the equipment does not compose a better photo. The person does that even today and always will. You cannot deny though that the tools to do so have both increased the opportunity, the ease, the options and the cost. Photography is no longer the domain of the well-off enthusiast.

    As a result, something like 90% of all photos ever taken have been taken in the last ten years. Most of these are personal records and keepsakes. Many others are shared on things like social networks like Facebook. Nothing wrong with that. It is just the way it is and the result of universal imaging, transmitting, storage and sharing technology.

    We are now seeing cameras with GPS and Wi-Fi and the latest development being integrated instant uploading of images to the cloud or anywhere. The very latest technological development is not only a phone and camera combined (that's been commonplace to the extent of now being normal) but a whole computer system and interface being integrated with the introduction of the Samsung Android phone.

    None of this makes for better pictures but it does create opportunities to catch the moment in still and the event in video.
    Some people just don't like the fact that photography has become universal rather than exclusive and restrictive.

    Television has the potential for being just as universal. Indeed millions of little programs are uploaded and viewed daily to places like YouTube and Vimeo, many organized into channels that people subscribe to.

    It is the future, hear today, and mostly for the better.

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    2000 is a fair amount. As stated before I always have mine on high speed and when I go out for a full day, photographing tractors and farm machinery, I can do 2000. My 3 year old Canon has now clocked up nearly 300.000 shots. The problem is now the stack of external harddrives next to my pc!

    Luckily I was clever enough to file all my photographs in a large Excel sheet. This means I can look up when I photo'd a certain make, machine, model, owner etc.. If you don't the 300.000 photo's become unmanageable!

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    Senior Member Cowabunga's Avatar
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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    Quote Originally Posted by Niels View Post
    2000 is a fair amount. As stated before I always have mine on high speed and when I go out for a full day, photographing tractors and farm machinery, I can do 2000. My 3 year old Canon has now clocked up nearly 300.000 shots. The problem is now the stack of external harddrives next to my pc!

    Luckily I was clever enough to file all my photographs in a large Excel sheet. This means I can look up when I photo'd a certain make, machine, model, owner etc.. If you don't the 300.000 photo's become unmanageable!
    I can imagine! The mind boggles.

    But why bother burst shooting universally when you can have simple single shots or just bracketing of various parameters when appropriate? As you say, the cataloguing must be a bit of a pain.
    At that rate you might as well be shooting video and taking the odd still from that when needed.

    It is your business of course and if it suits you, as it does, great. One thing I'd like to know is just what is the operating life of the shutter and the lens aperture mechanism? The camera itself in fact? I would have thought that any camera would have a finite design life.
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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    The D200 has GPS but I can't give you details as it is written in techno-jargon (!). It also embeds time and date and technical information in the picture -- which has been very handy in my claim for flood damage! I can also rescue a lot of pictures that would have been dumped in the past using Paint Shop Pro. I got a zoom lens and had intended getting a telephoto, but the definition is so good I just enlarge (or, more usually, crop!) to what I want!

    It's amazing, considering the technology available, how Mr Joe Average (including me) still seems to manage to get it wrong!

    As for non-linear video editing, all I can say is that the software comes with three manuals each an inch thick.... It has taken me a couple of years to learn how to use it properly and there is still a tonne to learn. The old BVU was clunky but I have one of the old broadcast machines (original price well into five figures) beside me and it still whirrs away like a Rolls Royce. I can do a tape path alignment myself on that but couldn't even see the internal workings of the modern camcorder!

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    Quote Originally Posted by Dry Rot View Post
    The D200 has GPS but I can't give you details as it is written in techno-jargon (!). It also embeds time and date and technical information in the picture -- which has been very handy in my claim for flood damage! I can also rescue a lot of pictures that would have been dumped in the past using Paint Shop Pro. I got a zoom lens and had intended getting a telephoto, but the definition is so good I just enlarge (or, more usually, crop!) to what I want!

    It's amazing, considering the technology available, how Mr Joe Average (including me) still seems to manage to get it wrong!

    As for non-linear video editing, all I can say is that the software comes with three manuals each an inch thick.... It has taken me a couple of years to learn how to use it properly and there is still a tonne to learn. The old BVU was clunky but I have one of the old broadcast machines (original price well into five figures) beside me and it still whirrs away like a Rolls Royce. I can do a tape path alignment myself on that but couldn't even see the internal workings of the modern camcorder!
    I think that your camera was one of the first 'professional' cameras with an APS-C size sensor. Being a Nikon they call it a DX system IIRC. A quality bit of kit and probably weighs a ton. But it is the lenses that probably give it superb image quality more than anything. Just as my Sony takes much sharper pictures with the bright prime 35mm than with the otherwise very good kit zooms.
    The more manual control you have over the camera, the more scope there is for getting it wrong. But where's the challenge and fun in setting everything to 'auto' at all times.

    If it means getting the shot or not, then auto is a perfectly good setting. One that I use for about half the pictures I take. Modern cameras with automatic scene recognition and even auto HDR in that mode, do take stunning pictures in auto.

    There have been a heck of a lot of developments in the last six years. Six years is near half the total life of the digital camera consumer technology. You might be surprised at how far things have developed even from your very highly specified [for the time] machine. One thing you probably won't notice though and will rarely find, is a better picture quality than yours is capable of when the light is good.

    It is undoubtedly a lovely tool. Look after it.
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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    I got an adaptor so i could use some of my Zuiko lenses that I had on the Olympus but the results were disappointing. I spoke to a professional photographer about that and he told me the switch over just doesn't work, something to do with how digital handles light. The pictures lack contrast, for one thing, which can to some extent be corrected. I'm sure you will know the answer but it was all way over my head!

    The D200 is the "serious amateur" version of the professional camera used at that time by Press photographers, etc. Sorry, model numbers are long since forgotten. It has all the bells and whistles and I shall never use one quarter of them.

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    Quote Originally Posted by Dry Rot View Post
    I got an adaptor so i could use some of my Zuiko lenses that I had on the Olympus but the results were disappointing. I spoke to a professional photographer about that and he told me the switch over just doesn't work, something to do with how digital handles light. The pictures lack contrast, for one thing, which can to some extent be corrected. I'm sure you will know the answer but it was all way over my head!

    The D200 is the "serious amateur" version of the professional camera used at that time by Press photographers, etc. Sorry, model numbers are long since forgotten. It has all the bells and whistles and I shall never use one quarter of them.
    The D2X I think, not that I'd recognise one if it ran me down on the Pelican Crossing.

    The Olympus might well have been a full frame job compared with the APS-C cropped sensor that you have now. That means, I guess, that your Olympus lenses will be 1.5 times longer [greater magnification] than when fitted to your original camera.
    I don't know what you have got but the Olympus lenses are now probably manual focus only on the new camera. I guess that they will have manual aperture as well but if they don't have a manual aperture adjusting ring they will only operate fully open. In any case your exposure will be fully manual, but at least the camera has a built-in light meter indication I guess.
    If the aperture is permanently fully open, that could explain your disappointing picture quality at times. Without a dark filter in front of the lens it will be difficult not to overexpose when shooting in good light.
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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    Very highly cropped picture from a fast burst of frames. From a compact system camera, not a traditional compact per-se. There are many current advanced compacts that will take high definition bursts though. This one has been cropped from a full 5MB file down to a 570KB size. If the original resolution and file size was already small, such cropping would result in an unusable picture.

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    Quote Originally Posted by Cowabunga View Post
    I can imagine! The mind boggles.

    But why bother burst shooting universally when you can have simple single shots or just bracketing of various parameters when appropriate? As you say, the cataloguing must be a bit of a pain.
    At that rate you might as well be shooting video and taking the odd still from that when needed.

    It is your business of course and if it suits you, as it does, great. One thing I'd like to know is just what is the operating life of the shutter and the lens aperture mechanism? The camera itself in fact? I would have thought that any camera would have a finite design life.
    Most of the time I shoot single pictures (whilst retaining high speed mode) and whenever a machine is coming close, and I want lots of shots, i can use high speed mode. Having to switch over from single shot to high speed is of to much bother when a tractor is running at you going fast. It takes some getting used to but I have mastered it fairly well.

    I do take some videos as well (have a Canon XF 100 digital video camera) but will always prefer photo over video. It is much easier and quicker to do. My biggest issue with filming is that, once you have shot an hour worth of footage, you then have to edit it all back to 3-4 minutes. That costs you a day alone! If I go out and take say 500 photographs of tractors I will pick out about a 100 for my website.

    So far, touch wood, my camera hasn't given any issues whatsoever. As I said it's 3 years old now and done 300k photo's. With the 400D before they told me the shutter would get knackered at 300.000 but the 50D is of course alltogether more professional and I expect it to last longer. Also, I have never had error codes come up. This was often the case with the old 400D. I will try and keep it until the 50D's replacement is out. The 60D would be a step back and the 7D has some functions that I miss. From what I read on the internet an 50/60D replacement is up for early 2014.

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    In some of the earlier video cameras, the problem was component failure, typically capacitors. Also, some the glue that was used became conductive with age! The trouble with those sorts of problems is that everything is fine and then, because the manufacturers bought in bulk, a whole generation of camcorders all begin to fail at the same age.

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    Re: Compact cameras - hi-speed-burst setting

    In some of the earlier video cameras, the problem was component failure, typically capacitors. Also, some the glue that was used became conductive with age! The trouble with those sorts of problems is that everything is fine and then, because the manufacturers bought in bulk, a whole generation of camcorders begin to fail at the same age.

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