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Thread: dependant scotland

  1. #1
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    dependant scotland

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNpD...e_gdata_player

    now thats a fare thats worth paying

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    Senior Member Wee Dram's Avatar
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    Re: dependant scotland

    3 Minutes of that idiot was more than enough for me

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by wind up View Post
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNpD...e_gdata_player

    now thats a fare thats worth paying
    Ultimately only a complete idiot would vote for independence but if you want popularity politics that is what will happen.

    It won't matter a jot to the UK, your banking sector doesn't have any critical mass and you won't have sterling so you'll be screwed but do carry on.

    Trident coming home would be no bad thing either. The boys at Devonport will love it. Plus two new carriers, merry Christmas.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    I actually like the english, but the time has come for scotland to plough its own furrow.
    I wish the rest of the UK well, and hope you reciprocate.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by danseyspass View Post
    I actually like the english, but the time has come for scotland to plough its own furrow.
    I wish the rest of the UK well, and hope you reciprocate.
    If the choice came between cutting my own foot off with a blunt hacksaw or voting for that prick Salmond I'd be on crutches shortly after I can assure you.

    At the end of the day I feel sorry for the Mel Gibson braveheart; either way you still end up with him.

    Anyone with even the most basic grasp of economics would realise that the Scottish banking sector is about as fragile as a china cup.

    Blame all your problems on the English 'robbing your oil' if you so wish, but the cost of your welfare state will be crippling. Best of luck with the Euro and gaining membership with the EU, too.

    Don't forget, all that oil infrastructure will want decommissioning one day, too.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    If the choice came between cutting my own foot off with a blunt hacksaw or voting for that prick Salmond I'd be on crutches shortly after I can assure you.

    At the end of the day I feel sorry for the Mel Gibson braveheart; either way you still end up with him.

    Anyone with even the most basic grasp of economics would realise that the Scottish banking sector is about as fragile as a china cup.

    Blame all your problems on the English 'robbing your oil' if you so wish, but the cost of your welfare state will be crippling. Best of luck with the Euro and gaining membership with the EU, too.

    Don't forget, all that oil infrastructure will want decommissioning one day, too.
    Its a great pity you cant be polite.
    I was taught that if you cant be polite, dont speak.
    Most scots think salmond is ok, and apply your label to cameron and osborne.
    Why does the banking sector matter? They are just a bunch of chancers anyway.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    what an obnoxious hate filled little man mayo is

    he's like the abusive husband that cant believe that his battered wife has finally dared to try and walk out on him. "YOU'LL NEVER SURVIVE ON YOUR OWN" he shouts "YOU'RE NOTHING WITHOUT ME" he rages. yeah, it might be tough to start off with, but few battered housewives want to go back once they finally escape

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by beeker View Post
    what an obnoxious hate filled little man mayo is

    he's like the abusive husband that cant believe that his battered wife has finally dared to try and walk out on him. "YOU'LL NEVER SURVIVE ON YOUR OWN" he shouts "YOU'RE NOTHING WITHOUT ME" he rages. yeah, it might be tough to start off with, but few battered housewives want to go back once they finally escape
    Hate filled? I'm sorry you must be mistaking me for someone else. I'm not hate filled at all. If I got the vote on independence, I would vote to get rid of Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland tomorrow.

    You can play the Nationalist tune all you like, and run around like Braveheart, long may Scotland be free and so on, but the harsh reality is that (as a government report has just outlined) that the average bod in England has less public spending allocated to them than the average bod in Scotland. For those who can't fathom basic economics 101, that means that the English tax payer is in fact seeing his money flow OUT of England and to other regions. As creative as the accountants might get, we can argue around the houses back and forth till the cows come home, the fact is the wealth is generated in London, and the rest of us are on their coat tails.

    I will giggle with glee when they get independence, I truly will. With a bit of luck Northern Ireland and Wales will want independence too.

    You can bang your gums about North sea oil, too. Ask any American where the money is made in oil. Got bugger all to do with where it is drawn out of the ground.

    Salmond is a bloody weird bloke. Anyone with any sense can see the bloke is only in it for himself, personal power. He has found a populist issue and will ride it all the way he can. Neither he nor his cronies have the first clue about running an economy much less a country. He is a 21st century Adolf Hitler.

    And by the way, I don't much care for the comparison between myself and a husband who practices personal abuse on his partner; probably the most distasteful piece of prose I have ever seen written on this forum.

    And lastly, anyone who needs to ask why the banking sector matters is probably the last person on earth suitable to be involved in a vote for independence.

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    Senior Member T P's Avatar
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    Re: dependant scotland

    One thing Mr Salmond hasn't thought through is that the cost of energy in the states is 1/3 of the cost of energy in the uk due to shale gas/fracking. If there is a big take off in fracking in the uk especially England a lot of the oil projected for future recovery north of the border will not be very profitable and indeed might be mothballed or never recovered at all. All the easy oil is long gone up North. The independence project doesn't stack up without big oil profits, and profits are never guaranteed.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Much as I dislike the tone of what Mayo is saying, I can't help but agree he may have a point or two. My big issue with Salmond and his sidekick wee Nicola is the fact a Plan B seems to be utterly absent. They are making big promises on things like currency and the EU but these aren't in their gift to deliver. Despite the three major Westminister parties completely ruling out a currency union, we still have John Swinney insisting it will happen - He's rapidly becoming the SNP's very own Comical Ali, peddling the party line despite it being apparent to all that it just won't happen.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by T P View Post
    One thing Mr Salmond hasn't thought through is that the cost of energy in the states is 1/3 of the cost of energy in the uk due to shale gas/fracking. If there is a big take off in fracking in the uk especially England a lot of the oil projected for future recovery north of the border will not be very profitable and indeed might be mothballed or never recovered at all. All the easy oil is long gone up North. The independence project doesn't stack up without big oil profits, and profits are never guaranteed.
    I believe the US will shortly be exporting oil once again for the first time in ages due to fracking.

    The big problem with oil is that it is a volatile market and all that infrastructure in the North Sea will one day have to be decommissioned and that does not come cheap.

    In any event the money made in oil is by refining it: not extracting it. Two refineries in Scotland and five or so in the rest of the UK. Do the maths.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    I'd quite happily see the Scots stay or go on there own makes no odds to me . If the Scots went on there own and invested the oil money wisely over the next 50/70 years then I don't see why life would be ok for the Scottish .

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    Re: dependant scotland

    I don't think the Scots will vote to leave. I hope not. Pretty much everything in the UK is 2 speed. London and the rest of us. It's just the way it is. Down here in pasty land we feel as cut off and as isolated as any Scot most of the time. Would we want to be independent of London? I doubt it. Well the Cornish might but they are a special case (joking). I hope the Scots can see beyond the shallow feelings and find the logic and sense they are so famous for. Most of us little Englanders want you to stay because we see beyond the Daily Mailesque, reactionary nonsense. The UK is pretty sweet really. It's not a bad deal. It could be worse. A lot worse.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    You can bang your gums about North sea oil, too. Ask any American where the money is made in oil. Got bugger all to do with where it is drawn out of the ground.


    This is bull s@@t by the way just off the phone with my mate who farms in Texas and he says he can't get any lads to work for him all on the oil wells can't buy/rent any more land all the oil well owners buying/renting it up banks have loads of money to lend but trying to get his hands on good land with water is the hard part.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Thankyou old oak tree for a balanced view.
    I never miss a good giggle at the vitriolic"you will never manage without us" rhetoric. True we would run a deficit, but what is the uk deficit? 10 billion per month?
    If the oil was so worthless, why was the mc crone report suppressed in 1979 which pointed out exactly the opposite?
    The ayrshire man was quite right to liken the scottish nation to a battered wife, told daily how useless she is and never able to survive without the BIG man .
    He wasnt referring to you, uworkformenow.
    As to the banks, they have brought this country to its knees, and are still making fools of us, and you think thats ok? hello?

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    Re: dependant scotland

    I think you have misunderstood my view on this matter I quoted "uwork.......me"about oil money not staying where it comes out of the ground in the USA and I have no feelings one way or the other weather the Scots head off on their own path or not .

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by oldoaktree View Post
    I think you have misunderstood my view on this matter I quoted "uwork.......me"about oil money not staying where it comes out of the ground in the USA and I have no feelings one way or the other weather the Scots head off on their own path or not .
    sorry oaktree, only the first line was aimed at you.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Dansseypass , I have re read your post and realize what you are saying now too much single malt tonight .

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    Re: dependant scotland

    i would ignore anything mayo says on the subject . every time scottish independance come up hes in there with his bigoted views telling us how were all a bunch of uneducated drunken layabouts sponging of the superior English . he probably thinks rab c nesbit is a docusoap . anybody thats been around these forums for any length of time will know he thinks he's an expert on everything . but we all now he's just got an over inflated ego , you just need to look at his user name now to confirm that one

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    the fact is the wealth is generated in London, and the rest of us are on their coat tails..
    IMO this is a little short sighted, there has been enormous amounts of money spent in London to encourage international trade. Those people that have made a fortune in London not from international trade are basically ripping off the rest of the uk. Everyone has their own opinion of how much money should be spent in London for this, and it appears us lot up in the north of the UK dont get much say on the matter the only thing we can do is chose weather or not the union works for us. The finacial sector as important it is, should not be the source for building the countries wealth we should be encouraging manufacturing and export. I personally am not looking forward to the vote, I think it's a big waste of money but it's the only thing we can do to get Westminster to turn round and think "Oh maybe Scotland can decide is own future". Forget about northsea oil that's a short term income what's going to happen in the future beyond? Will fresh water be the new resource of which there is plenty up here and the rest of the uk.
    "At the end of the day, I think it's going to get very dark."

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Aha! Wondered how long it would take for the inferiority complex to arrive!

    I'm a bigot am I? Not at all. I honestly couldn't give damn either way, but I resent the implication that somehow the English have been the root of all evils and are the reason life is so terrible yadda yadda yadda.

    Simple. Just vote independent and stop having my tax dollars. Trident comes home, as does the boat building.

    As for American oil production, having been to Texas I can tell you the whole place is covered in derricks but that didn't stop domestic oil production from falling off a cliff since about 1975. Americans still made a pretty penny in oil: by refining imported product. If they had relied only on domestic sources a lot of their refining base would have had nothing to refine. Google it. Only now is fracking beginning to halt the decline.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Jesus.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by Pasty View Post
    Jesus.
    You getting the picture now lol

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Having lived in Texas (many years ago) and still visit I can tell you that your are right about there being a lot of oil wells about the place ! What there is also a lot of in Texas is money from oil which came from Texas oil how much or little the demand is now is irelative thy drill New wells and pump the black gold . Some land owners own there wells some sell the rights bit like wind turbines over here I suppose. They get paid for the oil one way or the other then there's all the work force that comes with the industry. What happens to the oil after that is irreverent more proffit else where .
    Refinarys have to buy oil !

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Mayo I do find my self agreeing with you on occasion. I don't know you personally and don't even really know what you do but can you try contributing with a little less dogma, apparent arrogance and scorn.The trouble is you bring out the worst in others sometimes. Do you speak face to face like you post? I am probably wasting my breath but even the Duck has toned down a bit these days.
    As for Scotland I would be sad to see the break up of the UK, and I am convinced splitting up will leave all sides weakened. We are not talking of a country spanning a massive continent we are a small island.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    HBOS,RBS too big to fail. Bonnie Scotland too small to have bailed them out. Where's Salmond''s Icelandic model now?
    Norway is now his favoured model - welcome to 10 a pint and 70% income tax.
    As for Wales wanting independence - we will be quite happy taking all the extra money that would have been going to Scotland

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Banks were bailed out according to where they did business.Thats why the US fed pumped so much money into London.But the days of bank bail outs are gone now.EU,UK and US governments all accept that.If banks lend unwisely in the future their shareholders will take the hit first.Depositors second.Governments will have to pay more attention to bank regulation in order that depositors continue to trust bankers with their hard earned cash.Iceland jailed their criminal spiv bankers.The UK is a political and economic construct that was successful at conquering and exploiting other peoples round the globe.Those days are over.Time to restructure.Time to move forward.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by danseyspass View Post
    Its a great pity you cant be polite.
    I was taught that if you cant be polite, dont speak.
    Most scots think salmond is ok, and apply your label to cameron and osborne.
    Why does the banking sector matter? They are just a bunch of chancers anyway.
    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by essexpete View Post
    Mayo I do find my self agreeing with you on occasion. I don't know you personally and don't even really know what you do but can you try contributing with a little less dogma, apparent arrogance and scorn.The trouble is you bring out the worst in others sometimes. Do you speak face to face like you post? I am probably wasting my breath but even the Duck has toned down a bit these days.
    As for Scotland I would be sad to see the break up of the UK, and I am convinced splitting up will leave all sides weakened. We are not talking of a country spanning a massive continent we are a small island.
    +1


    Quote Originally Posted by windylamb View Post
    HBOS,RBS too big to fail. Bonnie Scotland too small to have bailed them out. Where's Salmond''s Icelandic model now?
    Norway is now his favoured model - welcome to 10 a pint and 70% income tax.
    As for Wales wanting independence - we will be quite happy taking all the extra money that would have been going to Scotland
    You cant blame Scotland for de-regulating the banks and setting up a catastrophic failure in the UK financial sector.

    What extra money is that you speak of? Im glad your happy to stay part of the UK, I wish you well. And your welcome to the 230million which the EU sent over and was destined for Scottish agriculture, but Westminster decided it keep and distribute to Wales and England (why not NI??). But make no mistake, when Cameron gets his EU referendum and England votes the UK out of europe - you will get f**k all from anyone.

    Scotland, if independent, may well not get into europe - something i doubt, But i do feel the major sticking point to our membership is Europe wanting/forcing Scotland to take the Euro currency. Our own new currency would be a better option to that - something alot of the population seems very open to.
    Scotland also may not get to keep Osbournes - but youl only ever see Westminsters REAL stand on that matter, if the 'NO/Better Together' campaign has failed. I doubt it couldnt be used as it does make better sense for everyone involved (and the precedent was set with the Rep. of Ireland, which kept and used the for 60 or 70 years after becoming independent, before using the Punt), and ofcourse - Scotland would not be obliged to 'take' our share of the UK debt.
    If in doubt, yank it out!

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    Re: dependant scotland

    You can't blame England, Wales or NI either. Although the 2 PM's who presided over the whole disaster were both born up your way. You can blame Labour but that's another argument. I wish Scotland well whatever she decides. My wife is a Scot and so I know quite of a few and it seems among them there is a sense of sadness and that this is a regressive move. One thing that particularly hacks them off is that Scots living outside of Scotland seemingly cannot vote. That's just bollocks isn't it? I assume that was Salmond's idea and seems very isolationist to me.

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    Re: dependant scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by Pasty View Post
    You can't blame England, Wales or NI either. Although the 2 PM's who presided over the whole disaster were both born up your way. You can blame Labour but that's another argument. I wish Scotland well whatever she decides. My wife is a Scot and so I know quite of a few and it seems among them there is a sense of sadness and that this is a regressive move. One thing that particularly hacks them off is that Scots living outside of Scotland seemingly cannot vote. That's just bollocks isn't it? I assume that was Salmond's idea and seems very isolationist to me.

    No, you cant. But the poster was, to me, trying to somehow pin the blame on Scotland for the banks. Yes, sadly Blair was born up here. But the COUNTRY voted them in. Just as SCOTLAND voted in the SNP, and their manifesto. A manifesto which contains a referendum on independence. Something which has been part of their manifesto since long before Salmond and Sturgeon were born. Many of those 'down south' who dislike Salmond should remember this.

    Its an interesting point, but certainly not bollocks. I suspect in any independence referendum the world over, if you do not live within the region wanting to 'break-away' you do not get a vote. If you were to include those living in other parts of the UK, where do you draw the line? My cousin currently lives in Germany, and has done for about 5 years, should she get a vote? What about all those Scots who emigrated to New Zealand, Australia or Canada? You can see how muddled or complex that could become.......

    Also got to remember that those who were born throughout the UK, and are now registered as living in Scotland, get to vote. I dont see any other way in which the electorate could have been drawn up clearly.

    If it is a regressive move - why does Cameron want to have a referendum on Europe? Why does he want the UK to break away and do things their own way? Why does he want to leave a larger community? To answer those questions, youl start to realise Scotlands view and position within the Union.
    If in doubt, yank it out!

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