Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 31 to 60 of 84

Thread: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

  1. #31
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Somerset
    Posts
    2,820

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    You guys wanting into the global market want to be careful what you wish for. I have been there and seen it and have seen what other countries do and how they do it. It is not to be smiled at. Some of them are operating with far fewer regulations and with much lower baseline costs, and in addition they have a huge disparity in currency values to sweeten their end of the deal.

    It is not 'efficient' to have multi million pound processing plants sat idle waiting for a spring flush of milk to keep them busy, anyone with any kind of business acumen beyond that in the agricultural realm would realise that in an instant. Do you think Muller can just park up the tankers, turn off the lights and send everyone home for 5 months of the year? That is like Ford producing no cars at all for months on end whilst waiting for some cheap steel to be made available in the world market.

    In any event if the UK farmer does not produce a steady level supply of milk every month of the year in this country, to feed the demands of their own consumers, then I can guarantee it will be Poland, Denmark, Holland etc who step up to the mark. In Eastern Europe in particular, there are huge tracts of land with nothing growing there. They can grow crops till the cows come home if the incentive was there.

  2. #32

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    seems to be a lot of preaching on here ,both systems can be good and bad
    Is seasonality a penalty for spring calvers or a bonus for those that AYR ,I think it depends on how you view it.

  3. #33
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Argyll west coast Scotland
    Posts
    114

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    You guys wanting into the global market want to be careful what you wish for. I have been there and seen it and have seen what other countries do and how they do it. It is not to be smiled at. Some of them are operating with far fewer regulations and with much lower baseline costs, and in addition they have a huge disparity in currency values to sweeten their end of the deal.

    It is not 'efficient' to have multi million pound processing plants sat idle waiting for a spring flush of milk to keep them busy, anyone with any kind of business acumen beyond that in the agricultural realm would realise that in an instant. Do you think Muller can just park up the tankers, turn off the lights and send everyone home for 5 months of the year? That is like Ford producing no cars at all for months on end whilst waiting for some cheap steel to be made available in the world market.

    In any event if the UK farmer does not produce a steady level supply of milk every month of the year in this country, to feed the demands of their own consumers, then I can guarantee it will be Poland, Denmark, Holland etc who step up to the mark. In Eastern Europe in particular, there are huge tracts of land with nothing growing there. They can grow crops till the cows come home if the incentive was there.
    At last someone with balanced view, I started this thread to get sensible views not turn one producer against another. all milk buyers are looking at this subject at the moment and some of the smart assed opinions don't help anyone. If we don't find a way to work this massive spring flush out we will be left with this cycle of slow price increases and rapid savage cuts, volatility year after year.

  4. #34
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    176

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Bald Rick View Post
    Help .. I don't want to hog the thread but there a few misconceptions in there NH.

    Robots are no more costly to buy & install than a high end parlour - possibly a bit less but there is good 2d hand value. I am well aware that, like computing, robotics moves relatively quickly hence why so much of it is plug & play with updates either remotely or at service time. We are finding them very reliable.

    We are now reaching the stage when the farm is working hard and every acre is "washing its face" (Dreadful expression but does the job) and with cheap money & the ability to fix it for 10 years, financing to go forward is not something to be frightened of. All our budgeting is done on a 6ppl (B&W) drop as the starting point.
    Technology should be embraced ....... though not in tractors - I sat in a Fendt recently and didn't have a clue.

    Help, I too agree about jamming this thread up with side tracked conversation. I could chat for hours.
    After a 6 year affair with heat time as new technology example, I have gone into reverse - I recently came to the conclusion it only pays if you set out making your farm to need it - if you get my meaning. Its great when its all new, but suddenly your into a slippery slope of money hungry manufacturing companies. I was frightened. It was a relief to spend £100 on tail paint and watch the cows for 9 weeks.

    No Antibiotics is the next step

    But back to The thread - Block calve at agreed times of the year and keep life simple for those that like too. Omsco is managing very well.

  5. #35
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    486

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Moors Farmer View Post
    Regarding paying a premium - no. Seasonality deductions/payments are about right. Imo.
    Seasonality payments are much the same today as they have allways been, the same as when milk was 16ppl. Today with milk at more like 32ppl they are effectively half what they were, minus 6ppl in the spring and plus 5ppl in the autumn would make things look a bit different.

  6. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Northern Ireland
    Posts
    1,070

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by RED BULL View Post
    Seasonality payments are much the same today as they have allways been, the same as when milk was 16ppl. Today with milk at more like 32ppl they are effectively half what they were, minus 6ppl in the spring and plus 5ppl in the autumn would make things look a bit different.
    So you are looking at it in terms of proportions. Should you though? Milk price has doubled. Has our margin doubled? Well perhaps right now it is higher than normal, but when price settles back a bit, I expect we will return to considerably lower margins. Therefore in more a more normal margin environment, the seasonality in ppl +/- should be similar to before, rather than moving in proportion to the overall price.

    I think in it is perfectly reasonable for companies to impose seasonality adjustments. It should be done simply according to the particular markets in which the company is operating, and how much pressure they need to apply to correct their member supply profile. So a liquid only dairy will want to have it very tight, and a commodity manufacturer perhaps less so.

    Companies have to steer suppliers all the time on things like components, hygiene, farm quality assurance, collection costs - timing of the supply is just another one on that list.

  7. #37
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Somerset
    Posts
    2,820

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    The very fact buyers apply seasonality, constituents or hygiene penalties/bonuses is surely a sign that the market is very clearly indicating what it wants. Either you supply what they want or your milk price ends up being less than what you wanted.

    It is not up to the market to respond to farmers. Farmers must respond to the market. LF has it around the wrong way.

  8. #38
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Shropshire
    Posts
    111

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Moors Farmer View Post
    That's impressive.
    81% conception rate to first service is incredible - is this cows or youngstock?

  9. #39
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    157

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    The very fact buyers apply seasonality, constituents or hygiene penalties/bonuses is surely a sign that the market is very clearly indicating what it wants. Either you supply what they want or your milk price ends up being less than what you wanted.

    It is not up to the market to respond to farmers. Farmers must respond to the market. LF has it around the wrong way.
    Yes, you have to provide what the market wants BUT Lazy farmer is more supporting block calving which is way more efficient than AYR calving. Different producers can block calve at different times of the year to supply a level supply. Some can calve in summer, others winter and others spring or autumn.

  10. #40
    Senior Member Bald Rick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Anglesey
    Posts
    1,010

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Enry View Post
    81% conception rate to first service is incredible - is this cows or youngstock?
    I will admit it is skewed by a number of factors:

    1) Jerseys - naturally more fertile
    2) Heifers in their first lactation so 2nd calf
    3) All ours calved without aid bar one which we had to straighten a leg although we have put a large number back to BB
    4) very few needed a wash out
    5) Heat time seems very accurate
    6) we have these fancy lights & a new build shed designed for the cow with plenty of space everywhere
    7) good feet. Very little lameness
    8) Luck!

    #8 is the key

    No doubt we've touched the stars & reality will bite me on the ar*e next year.

  11. #41
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    219

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    The very fact buyers apply seasonality, constituents or hygiene penalties/bonuses is surely a sign that the market is very clearly indicating what it wants. Either you supply what they want or your milk price ends up being less than what you wanted.

    It is not up to the market to respond to farmers. Farmers must respond to the market. LF has it around the wrong way.
    Ah what it is to right all the time hey Ollie. went to the pub the other night and friendly milk buyer was in with his irish co op business partner. I asked him whether he had either bought or sold distressed milk this spring he said no and no, they still have spare capacity going forward and would run the plant at weekends if nessercary rather than turn away spring block calvers. milk buyer also told us the results of the little farmer survey he did earlier in the year. there is a move towards crossbreeding regardless of production type and there is a move towards autumn block calving amongst their farmers he was well chuffed and still actively looking to recruit spring block calvers. I left well chuffed too milk buyer paid for dinner and I felt optimistic for the future of my "species" but then I'm usually wrong....... hey Ollie.

    lazy

  12. #42
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Bay Of Plenty NZ
    Posts
    127

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    AYR should be banned? Or it is 'inefficient'?

    Come off it LF, you're no more efficient or otherwise than anyone else. I can assure you that someone somewhere on planet earth can crank out milk cheaper or faster or in greater quantities than you.

    The market quite clearly wants a steady milk supply because who the hell can afford to build or run plants which sit empty for half the year? It can't won't and never will happen. This is not New Zealand and we are stuck with the value of Sterling I am afraid, unless you want to join the YouRow of course.

    You wind me up because there are people making perfectly good money doing something you detest. Just because it does not suit you don't level your ire at it.

    You need to remember that block calving systems work well exactly because not everyone is prepared or able to do it. If the UK was nearly 100% spring calving you'd all be in the same vice.

    As for pressing on regardless and 'letting the market decide', I think that kind of attitude in agriculture has been its bane for decades. If I have learned anything in recent years it is that you should produce something the market wants when it wants it. You don't just do your own thing and hope that the market accepts it by coincidence.

    As for you Stewart. You bring nothing to this debate, I for one am tired with your holier than thou attitude and predilection for bashing subsidies and our industry in general. You can root for team NZ all you want but it means bugger all here.

    If you want my opinion of the dairy industry in the UK it is pretty much thus. It doesn't matter if you are big or small, owners or tenants, high input, low input, AYR or block, none of it makes any difference, you just need to be good. A relatively simple system, done well, and with clear goals is where I think some flourish but that is only my small view on it.

    I will never understand the back biting and need to trash other peoples ideas or systems, it benefits no one. You are all in the same boat.
    I do not recollect mentioning NZ or NZ milk production in my post on this thread, although interestingly many NZ farmers are working towards a more level supply, calving twice a year instead of once, the co-ops and processors are encouraging this through the payment structure.

    My reference to subsidies was trying to point out that interfering in market forces creates inefficiencies; by banning a particular farming system this is interfering in the market, creating the potential for inefficient production.

    Let the market decide what the payments should be at any particular time of year, when milk is in short supply the price goes up and in times of surplus it will go down, if it costs less to produce milk with a spring calving herd it would not take long for the processors to realise that a farmer would accept a lower price, conversely to have a supply of milk in autumn, processors would have to increase price, it is quite easy to adjust the milk price to get a supply at the time of year it is needed. It was always done in the past with a seasonality payment.

    What do you mean by being “stuck with the value of Sterling”, (from our past discussions on FOREX I am unsure if your are incredibly naive on the subject or just plain dumb) the GBP is, at the moment, quite a weak currency and possibly undervalued, as the UK comes out of recession (which I believe it will and very quickly) the exchange rate should rise. The world is moving towards a more global market, diminishing the impact of FOREX, so the strength or weakness of a currency has less relevance.

  13. #43
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    157

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Stewart View Post
    I do not recollect mentioning NZ or NZ milk production in my post on this thread, although interestingly many NZ farmers are working towards a more level supply, calving twice a year instead of once, the co-ops and processors are encouraging this through the payment structure.

    My reference to subsidies was trying to point out that interfering in market forces creates inefficiencies; by banning a particular farming system this is interfering in the market, creating the potential for inefficient production.

    Let the market decide what the payments should be at any particular time of year, when milk is in short supply the price goes up and in times of surplus it will go down, if it costs less to produce milk with a spring calving herd it would not take long for the processors to realise that a farmer would accept a lower price, conversely to have a supply of milk in autumn, processors would have to increase price, it is quite easy to adjust the milk price to get a supply at the time of year it is needed. It was always done in the past with a seasonality payment.

    What do you mean by being “stuck with the value of Sterling”, (from our past discussions on FOREX I am unsure if your are incredibly naive on the subject or just plain dumb) the GBP is, at the moment, quite a weak currency and possibly undervalued, as the UK comes out of recession (which I believe it will and very quickly) the exchange rate should rise. The world is moving towards a more global market, diminishing the impact of FOREX, so the strength or weakness of a currency has less relevance.
    Stewart, our milk price is governed by the marketplace. There is no subsidies on milk production. In N.Ireland the milk price can vary as much as 50% some months because it is sold on the world market for powder. In the mainland UK they have a larger liquid market so have more stable prices, but if there is too much milk, prices go down same as with you.

    As for your mentioning of GBP strength, the pound has got a lot stronger in the past 12 months and is actually quite a strong currency at the moment.

  14. #44
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    north cornwall
    Posts
    9

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Can I just point out that its not just block spring calvers that produce milk in the spring. AYR calvers produce milk in the spring as well so their also contributing to the spring flush. I'm actually not producing any more milk this spring than last. Its more likely high input herds feeding cows more than normal because of the high milk prices thats led to this year's milk increase.
    So no i don't think AYR calvers should get a premium, all spring milk should be treated the same within each company.

  15. #45
    Senior Member Bald Rick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Anglesey
    Posts
    1,010

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Steakeater View Post
    Yes, you have to provide what the market wants BUT Lazy farmer is more supporting block calving which is way more efficient than AYR calving. Different producers can block calve at different times of the year to supply a level supply. Some can calve in summer, others winter and others spring or autumn.
    I'm sorry but I'm a bit thick & slow. Yet another poster is mentioning that block calving is more "efficient" than AYR. Can someone please explain in words of one syllable why that is so in order that I can be illuminated? I thank you

  16. #46
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    219

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Bald Rick View Post
    I'm sorry but I'm a bit thick & slow. Yet another poster is mentioning that block calving is more "efficient" than AYR. Can someone please explain in words of one syllable why that is so in order that I can be illuminated? I thank you
    there are always exceptions to the rule but many studies show a difference between spring and AYR of up to 6p in terms of profit and upto 5p autumn block verses AYR. the consultancy group we use occasionally did analysis of farms using there full costings service and came up with similar figures. It isn't just one area where costs are lower its down the whole page and personally for the simple minded like me being able to concentrate on one task at a time and knowing the importance of that job really helps. At the end of the day financials are really the best measures of efficiency are they not?

    lazy

  17. #47
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Argyll west coast Scotland
    Posts
    114

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by lazy farmer View Post
    there are always exceptions to the rule but many studies show a difference between spring and AYR of up to 6p in terms of profit and upto 5p autumn block verses AYR. the consultancy group we use occasionally did analysis of farms using there full costings service and came up with similar figures. It isn't just one area where costs are lower its down the whole page and personally for the simple minded like me being able to concentrate on one task at a time and knowing the importance of that job really helps. At the end of the day financials are really the best measures of efficiency are they not?

    lazy
    Ahhh Those Consultants the guys who can't do it themselves but can tell you how to spend YOUR money !!!!
    Maybe we should have a cull of them as they are the one's who are telling eveyone to go to spring calving !!

    I know one guy who block calves and feeds only 1 ton of concs and another who calves all year round, cows are housed all year and you could not split their financials one low input and one very high but both very good operaters.

    And remember paper takes on anything, and where consultants are involved you should use it to wipe your ..... !!

  18. #48
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    219

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Argyll View Post
    Ahhh Those Consultants the guys who can't do it themselves but can tell you how to spend YOUR money !!!!
    Maybe we should have a cull of them as they are the one's who are telling eveyone to go to spring calving !!

    I know one guy who block calves and feeds only 1 ton of concs and another who calves all year round, cows are housed all year and you could not split their financials one low input and one very high but both very good operaters.

    And remember paper takes on anything, and where consultants are involved you should use it to wipe your ..... !!
    Well I have a lot to thank ours for. around the time of deregulation year on year we were just moving the deck chairs around on the titanic leasing quota etc So 18yrs ago now we started to change to block calving. So I don't think you can fairly cull mine apart from on the grounds he may have spawned others!
    I did say there are exceptions to the rule but when the same analysis is applied to differing farming systems and you don't like the results I don't see why they become toilet paper?

    lazy

  19. #49
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    189

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    If your short of grazing area then autumn or ayr calving would be the preferred option. If you've got acres then spring calving? I prefer ayr calving as it suits our infrastructure and labour set up.

    Market seems to be the last thing anyone looks at?

  20. #50
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Bay Of Plenty NZ
    Posts
    127

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Steakeater View Post
    Stewart, our milk price is governed by the marketplace. There is no subsidies on milk production. In N.Ireland the milk price can vary as much as 50% some months because it is sold on the world market for powder. In the mainland UK they have a larger liquid market so have more stable prices, but if there is too much milk, prices go down same as with you.

    As for your mentioning of GBP strength, the pound has got a lot stronger in the past 12 months and is actually quite a strong currency at the moment.
    With a small population very little of our milk goes into the liquid market. This season, with a high summer milk peak, the driers were at full capacity. This resulted in some milk going in to lower paying products, as the world price for powder is so high, farmers received a lower payout than they would have done, had the industry either had the capacity to dry more, or had a level profile of milk supply.

    The payout here now exceeds the price received by the UK dairy farmer, with such a low percentage of milk going into the home market and the costs of shipping milk products a long distance why should that be? The old MMB encouraged inefficiencies and high costs in the processing side of the industry, are those high costs still there after 20 years?

    The GDP has strengthened in the last 12 months,it is still significantly weaker than it was 10 years ago, down 20% against the Euro,9% against the USD,15% against the Yen, and more than 30% against both the Aussie and Kiwi dollar.

  21. #51
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Somerset
    Posts
    2,820

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Yawn

    LF- Sorry if you have taken offence but I know not why, I certainly am not always right if I was I would not be involved in this industry, I'd be in the city doing something else. By the way that is a lovely anecdote but you've not really made any response to what I have said. You claim more 'efficient'. Don't equate cost of production with efficiency and furthermore, I don't see why you are calling for a system you don't agree with to be banned. As for your mythical milk buyer, I am sure he loves buying cheap spring milk for a song however, no processor can afford to have a factor stood idle for months at a time. Try looking at it from a perspective other than your own. If you want I would willingly show you a myriad of farms where your system would fall on its ass quite spectacularly. You must also remember that people have GAEC to worry about now and the ministry are going to get hot on Phosphate pollution one day. There is no right answer and each farmer must adopt a system which suits him and his farm. I personally no longer have any preference for any system due to the experiences I have had of them all. I would say that any and all have the potential to perform well or perform poorly and it has nothing to do with costs or milk price or when the cows are calved.

    Stewart. I have been involved with the sharp end of commodity trading and probably understand the global market place better than yourself, as I was once paid to watch charts and prices. I am not sure how you can claim the Pound is a weak currency when one examines this chart:

    http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?fr...o=USD&view=10Y

    I.e basically the strongest it has been since the 2008 downturn, when most major currencies, including your monopoly money took a bit hit as speculators pulled their cash out pronto.

    I am not sure what your game is but you come here with a peculiar chip on your shoulder at the insistence we are doing it all wrong and inefficient subsidy junkies. I am not quite sure to whom you are so maligned but I can assure you I regularly do work for people who are making money in milk and are quite happy with their lot, and do so without disadvantage to themselves, the environment or animal welfare. This is partly to do with their attitude, business acumen, managerial skill and not least the regulatory frame-work in which they must operate as well as wider market conditions.

    You will never have the a system in the UK where the milk market is controlled so effectively by a monopoly. Perhaps you are not aware that this is illegal under EU law.

    The UK will never become some kind of mega-exporter of agricultural commodities for the exact same reasons we do not export coal or cars in volumes comparable to the nations that do. If you are blind to this fact then I am not sure this forum is the ideal place for you. That being the case, as in many EU nations, they produce to supply their domestic markets and then export whatever high value surplus they can when conditions allow. Not always so straight forward due to differences in currency values.

    You are also being knowingly disingenuous when you talk of shipping costs.

  22. #52
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    somerset
    Posts
    44

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    firstly if these new entrants/ converters are starting up milking and just assuming that someone will take their milk, be it spring autumn or ayr then that is a bit daft
    secondly not all farms suit either system and only the farmer himself ought to know which system his farm suits
    thirdly i thought with the new super dairy combined with other dairies either building new or expanding we were geared up to take peak volumes
    fourthly i think the ideal system would be to have half spring block and half autumn , meaning cows could move between blocks and milk supply would be fairly level

  23. #53
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    219

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    Yawn

    LF- Sorry if you have taken offence but I know not why, I certainly am not always right if I was I would not be involved in this industry, I'd be in the city doing something else. By the way that is a lovely anecdote but you've not really made any response to what I have said. You claim more 'efficient'. Don't equate cost of production with efficiency and furthermore, I don't see why you are calling for a system you don't agree with to be banned. As for your mythical milk buyer, I am sure he loves buying cheap spring milk for a song however, no processor can afford to have a factor stood idle for months at a time. Try looking at it from a perspective other than your own. If you want I would willingly show you a myriad of farms where your system would fall on its ass quite spectacularly. You must also remember that people have GAEC to worry about now and the ministry are going to get hot on Phosphate pollution one day. There is no right answer and each farmer must adopt a system which suits him and his farm. I personally no longer have any preference for any system due to the experiences I have had of them all. I would say that any and all have the potential to perform well or perform poorly and it has nothing to do with costs or milk price or when the cows are calved.

    Stewart. I have been involved with the sharp end of commodity trading and probably understand the global market place better than yourself, as I was once paid to watch charts and prices. I am not sure how you can claim the Pound is a weak currency when one examines this chart:

    http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?fr...o=USD&view=10Y

    I.e basically the strongest it has been since the 2008 downturn, when most major currencies, including your monopoly money took a bit hit as speculators pulled their cash out pronto.

    I am not sure what your game is but you come here with a peculiar chip on your shoulder at the insistence we are doing it all wrong and inefficient subsidy junkies. I am not quite sure to whom you are so maligned but I can assure you I regularly do work for people who are making money in milk and are quite happy with their lot, and do so without disadvantage to themselves, the environment or animal welfare. This is partly to do with their attitude, business acumen, managerial skill and not least the regulatory frame-work in which they must operate as well as wider market conditions.

    You will never have the a system in the UK where the milk market is controlled so effectively by a monopoly. Perhaps you are not aware that this is illegal under EU law.

    The UK will never become some kind of mega-exporter of agricultural commodities for the exact same reasons we do not export coal or cars in volumes comparable to the nations that do. If you are blind to this fact then I am not sure this forum is the ideal place for you. That being the case, as in many EU nations, they produce to supply their domestic markets and then export whatever high value surplus they can when conditions allow. Not always so straight forward due to differences in currency values.

    You are also being knowingly disingenuous when you talk of shipping costs.
    yeap I've had enough of you too. just one final point if the milk buyer doesn't like having his plant standing idle why does he do it for 105 days a year already?

  24. #54

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    2002 3.4NZ$=£1. 2014 2NZ$=£1. Which one has got stronger?

    In 2013 UK built 1.5m cars and exported 1.2m cars overtaking France to become no3 in Europe. By 2017 production in UK is due to hit 2m cars, an all time UK record.

    I don't have the patience to go on

    Ollie, i just don' t get why you need to be so rude, arrogant and inaccurate in your posts. Surely life is too short.

  25. #55
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,467

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Sid View Post
    If your short of grazing area then autumn or ayr calving would be the preferred option. If you've got acres then spring calving? I prefer ayr calving as it suits our infrastructure and labour set up.

    Market seems to be the last thing anyone looks at?
    Good points. Lots of people want to farm, but we don't all have the perfect opportunity presented to us. Those of us who are fortunate enough to have a chance to farm often have to do the best we can with what we've got.

    Also, dairy farming is such an involved and all consuming occupation that it really has to be a passion for those who do it. there are different approaches, i don't think there's one single 'right' answer, but you have to chose the one that appeals to you because it's the kind of job that you can only do if your heart's in it.

    I think Lazy makes some very good points and i understand why he's so evangelical about his own system, but i disagree with his fundamentalist approach and his insistence that his is the only way.

  26. #56
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Bay Of Plenty NZ
    Posts
    127

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    Yawn


    Stewart. I have been involved with the sharp end of commodity trading and probably understand the global market place better than yourself, as I was once paid to watch charts and prices. I am not sure how you can claim the Pound is a weak currency when one examines this chart:

    http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?fr...o=USD&view=10Y

    I.e basically the strongest it has been since the 2008 downturn, when most major currencies, including your monopoly money took a bit hit as speculators pulled their cash out pronto.
    Very interesting chart that illustrates when you compare one weak currency with another weak currency they tend to have a similar track, with all your claimed experience in being paid to study charts and commodities, you will of course realise that to get the full picture of a currency it has to be compared with cross rates across a broad range.

    Currencies tend to have cycles, at the moment the pound is low when compared with a 20-year average and the NZD is high, nothing to get upset about it is just the way of the market.

    The 2008 downturn saw some wild fluctuations in values, although not all currencies dropped, some went up and some down, it would be mathematically impossible for them all to take a hit, with your vast knowledge and experience at the sharp end of trading you would realise this.

  27. #57
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Bay Of Plenty NZ
    Posts
    127

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by Farmer on a bike View Post
    2002 3.4NZ$=£1. 2014 2NZ$=£1. Which one has got stronger?

    In 2013 UK built 1.5m cars and exported 1.2m cars overtaking France to become no3 in Europe. By 2017 production in UK is due to hit 2m cars, an all time UK record.

    I don't have the patience to go on

    Ollie, i just don' t get why you need to be so rude, arrogant and inaccurate in your posts. Surely life is too short.
    If in 2002 £1 bought $3.4 and now it only buys $2 then obviously the pound has got weaker or the $ has got stronger, or as is more likely the case a combination of the two.

    it is great that the UK is increasing exports, helped by an advantageous currency, but also by the engineering skills and expertise of the UK long may it continue.
    Last edited by Stewart; 19-05-14 at 11:32 PM.

  28. #58
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Argyll west coast Scotland
    Posts
    114

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Very well said Joe some of the views show how it is difficult to get co-operation in our industry to what is a problem for everyone !!!

  29. #59
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Leicestershire
    Posts
    346

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    Quote Originally Posted by RED BULL View Post
    Seasonality payments are much the same today as they have allways been, the same as when milk was 16ppl. Today with milk at more like 32ppl they are effectively half what they were, minus 6ppl in the spring and plus 5ppl in the autumn would make things look a bit different.
    We're not far off that currently -5.6ppl for April and May and +4.6 ppl in autumn. Works on a % of standard litre price.

  30. #60
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Argyll west coast Scotland
    Posts
    114

    Re: Should All Year Round calving dairy herds get a premium

    I hear Arla are looking for a more level supply !!!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •