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Thread: UKIP & the Euro Elections

  1. #31
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by Derky View Post
    To come out of Europe would be a disaster, free trade would stop overnight.
    Trade was being carried on long before all this "everywhere, everyone and everything the SAME" carp!
    Seems a long time ago but I voted for a Common Market not for a United States of Europe based on the USSR concept

  2. #32
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    So, you'd like the return of British Leyland, the three day week, powercuts and Love Thy Neighbour on the telly?

    To be fair, i think those are some of the few things UKIP could deliver.
    I have had to clean up the keyboard (Tea )

  3. #33
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by Joyce View Post
    Trade was being carried on long before all this "everywhere, everyone and everything the SAME" carp!
    Seems a long time ago but I voted for a Common Market not for a United States of Europe based on the USSR concept
    Yes we have been hoodwinked over the years (I was too young to vote on that ) but I have read somewhere that the move to a more federal Europe was always the intention of those behind it (including Heath)

    We clearly need to reduce the heaving bureaucracies at all levels and avoid being controlled from the outside but we surely will need to be careful. Are we not quite small in relation to the rest of Europe? Will we need Europe more than they need us?

  4. #34
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by essexpete View Post
    Yes we have been hoodwinked over the years (I was too young to vote on that ) but I have read somewhere that the move to a more federal Europe was always the intention of those behind it (including Heath)

    We clearly need to reduce the heaving bureaucracies at all levels and avoid being controlled from the outside but we surely will need to be careful. Are we not quite small in relation to the rest of Europe? Will we need Europe more than they need us?
    Europe, (especially France) is always there when they need us.

  5. #35
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by banjo View Post
    yes its been very interesting over the last week or two if your interested in politics and I know a lot of people aren't.
    the thing that has surprised me is the kind of people that have voted for UKIP this time, they aren't racist as they have been put over by the media, there are all colours and creeds, gay and straight, young and old, some how they seem to have got people who don't vote out as well.
    the working class seem to be switching to them and this is what's surprised me, a large amount of labour and liberal support is moving there way!
    the other parties seem in denial at the moment and don't really know how to deal with it, I personally think it is a big moment for this country and they might well be playing a part in the next election, and maybe hold the balance of power if the scots vote for independence.

    I don't like the eu, so I'd vote out, the thought of non elected people telling us what to do grates with me and bribes off them won't change my mind!
    but the farming side would need some new policies in Britain's sole government. we seem to be sending millions of pounds into the eu every day and taking less out, so the remainder could be used somewhere else if some heads were banged together.
    we are all in this mind-set of receiving the sub off the eu ( I'm no different) so maybe without it there we would have to perform better as farmers, they say the strong survive and the others learn from them so farming could really change for the better if we embrace the challenge.
    there are many slipper farmers who would have a shock, maybe they would be forced to rent ground out to younger farmers and give them a start if the sub was stopped, god knows?
    very turbulent times ahead.
    I remember the time before we were fully in to the EU and had to deal as farmers with compensatory payments, and subsidised competition from Europe, especially Holland and Belgium.
    Farmers have been much better off being on more of an equal footing with European farmers,if not totally so.


    It is not racist to try to curb immigration, just realistic.

    Since the EU has expanded to take in poorer nations, the attractions of our society, including benefits, NHS, schooling, housing, you name it are overwhelming. Even if an immigrant comes to work, which is great, he/she takes the place of a Brit who then joyfully goes on to benefit, so it still costs.
    We would not NEED more housing if we did not take in another 200,000 people a year.
    All this puts pressure on the UK economy, it has the effect of reducing wages, so of course Milly is right living standards will suffer. Taxes have to be higher even if they are indirect, like VAT, fuel, council tax, so of course we will have a lower disposable income.

    Priding yourself on being a multicultural nation of compassion to others is all very well, but in the end, realistically, somebody has to pay.

    Maybe if Europe wants free movement it should pay the UK billions just to house that 200,000 a year.

    This is not racist, just realistic. Farage as a trader dealt in the harsh climate of trade, he HAD to be realistic.

    Jack Caley

  6. #36
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by GNJC View Post
    Well... I was born in the 1970s, but that is an aside. Think about what you have written, you are ridiculing the idea of two things: 1) our country being able to control its borders; 2) the will of a majority of the people. I guess you can dismiss that, but ignoring the mass of a population has always, anywhere been a dangerous thing.

    UKIP is a young party and certainly does need to get more professional (but not too much!) but it is not and never has been against immigration. It is, and I am, against mass immigration. People coming to do jobs we can't fill is a rational thing, allowing in vast numbers of Romanian or Bangladeshi peasants (in the literal sense of the word) simply doesn't appeal to me and I can't see a rational reason for either having done so or continuing to do so.

    Britain is an island not a country, but it has indeed had many cultures for a long time, from Cornwall to Sutherland and from Carms to Herts, cultures and languages and accents and songs etc. etc.. But it seems odd that in a modern democracy we are having multiculturalism imposed upon us, but then I guess you think Ed, Dave and Nick know what's best for us.
    Very well said! Agree 100%!

  7. #37
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by Joyce View Post
    Trade was being carried on long before all this "everywhere, everyone and everything the SAME" carp!
    Seems a long time ago but I voted for a Common Market not for a United States of Europe based on the USSR concept
    Exactly! here Here

  8. #38
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    I remember the time before we were fully in to the EU and had to deal as farmers with compensatory payments, and subsidised competition from Europe, especially Holland and Belgium.
    Farmers have been much better off being on more of an equal footing with European farmers,if not totally so.


    It is not racist to try to curb immigration, just realistic.

    Since the EU has expanded to take in poorer nations, the attractions of our society, including benefits, NHS, schooling, housing, you name it are overwhelming. Even if an immigrant comes to work, which is great, he/she takes the place of a Brit who then joyfully goes on to benefit, so it still costs.
    We would not NEED more housing if we did not take in another 200,000 people a year.
    All this puts pressure on the UK economy, it has the effect of reducing wages, so of course Milly is right living standards will suffer. Taxes have to be higher even if they are indirect, like VAT, fuel, council tax, so of course we will have a lower disposable income.

    Priding yourself on being a multicultural nation of compassion to others is all very well, but in the end, realistically, somebody has to pay.

    Maybe if Europe wants free movement it should pay the UK billions just to house that 200,000 a year.

    This is not racist, just realistic. Farage as a trader dealt in the harsh climate of trade, he HAD to be realistic.

    Jack Caley
    Another very well said post!

  9. #39
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    the very interesting thing about UKIP is it could be an every thing party for everyone.
    the other three parties stake their claim on various things and try to create arguments between the other supporters on all sides and that's what makes the status quo over the last god knows how many years.
    Ferage could just accept everyone and use all their ideas. it would be like starting from scratch with their manifesto, one sole party with good businessmen or women at the foundation and nick all the good policies off the other parties, this would draw the electorate to them in droves.
    some well written posts on this topic and makes you think what could be!

  10. #40
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    It would be great if you can somehow get it into law, that anyone wishing to be a politician could only seek to stand if they had experience of working in the "real" world i.e. not solely because working for other politicians, think tanks etc. Thus you built up a cadre of politicians who have real world experience and see the world for what it is rather than through purely ideological filters. Combat the rise of the professional politician.

  11. #41
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by essexpete View Post
    I have had to clean up the keyboard (Tea )
    did you spray?

  12. #42
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    So, you'd like the return of British Leyland, the three day week, powercuts and Love Thy Neighbour on the telly?

    To be fair, i think those are some of the few things UKIP could deliver.
    Now you're talking

  13. #43
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    I remember the time before we were fully in to the EU and had to deal as farmers with compensatory payments, and subsidised competition from Europe, especially Holland and Belgium.
    Farmers have been much better off being on more of an equal footing with European farmers,if not totally so.


    It is not racist to try to curb immigration, just realistic.

    Since the EU has expanded to take in poorer nations, the attractions of our society, including benefits, NHS, schooling, housing, you name it are overwhelming. Even if an immigrant comes to work, which is great, he/she takes the place of a Brit who then joyfully goes on to benefit, so it still costs.
    We would not NEED more housing if we did not take in another 200,000 people a year.
    All this puts pressure on the UK economy, it has the effect of reducing wages, so of course Milly is right living standards will suffer. Taxes have to be higher even if they are indirect, like VAT, fuel, council tax, so of course we will have a lower disposable income.

    Priding yourself on being a multicultural nation of compassion to others is all very well, but in the end, realistically, somebody has to pay.

    Maybe if Europe wants free movement it should pay the UK billions just to house that 200,000 a year.

    This is not racist, just realistic. Farage as a trader dealt in the harsh climate of trade, he HAD to be realistic.

    Jack Caley
    Nicely said

  14. #44
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Sorry but you guys just don't get it. You're being sucked in to the populist idea that somehow the EU is to blame for all the UKs problems and that most of it is due to 'forriners' coming here and claiming benefits and taekin our jobs' or some such crap.

    I wouldn't vote for Nigel Farage for all the tea in China. He is a one trick pony and the idea of him gaining any power scares me to death.

    Have UKIP got any serious policies regarding the economy, jobs, education, health or the like? Of course not.

    We need another few years of the terrible Tories I'm afraid whilst the economy sorts itself. Until that time nothing can be done to make any real difference to anything.

    As for farmers voting for a party who openly reject the EU and want out, I'm gobsmacked since it is only the EU who continue to insist on the CAP and paying you. All other UK parties of any colour would have done away with it years ago.

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    Sorry but you guys just don't get it. You're being sucked in to the populist idea that somehow the EU is to blame for all the UKs problems and that most of it is due to 'forriners' coming here and claiming benefits and taekin our jobs' or some such crap.

    I wouldn't vote for Nigel Farage for all the tea in China. He is a one trick pony and the idea of him gaining any power scares me to death.

    Have UKIP got any serious policies regarding the economy, jobs, education, health or the like? Of course not.

    We need another few years of the terrible Tories I'm afraid whilst the economy sorts itself. Until that time nothing can be done to make any real difference to anything.

    As for farmers voting for a party who openly reject the EU and want out, I'm gobsmacked since it is only the EU who continue to insist on the CAP and paying you. All other UK parties of any colour would have done away with it years ago.
    The CAP subsidy is no longer worth claiming, it would be better scrapped.
    Immigration has caused massive housing inflation and shortage, which is deeply unpopular unless you are a tory.

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by danseyspass View Post
    The CAP subsidy is no longer worth claiming, it would be better scrapped.
    I'd like to hold on to mine for now !

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by oldoaktree View Post
    I'd like to hold on to mine for now !
    subsidies mean you are paying more for fertiliser, machinery, seeds, rent, mortgage payments, vehicles, fuel etc etc.
    plus you have all the costs of compliance.

    better without, and lets see who can really farm.

  18. #48
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    I think a lot of posts here are still following the media's agenda. What hasn't been mentioned is that a majority, I believe, are fed up with political correctness. This, as far as the press are concerned is the elephant in the room. Modern politicians try even to control your thoughts; what is a 'hate crime'? PC is so insidious that it has had the effect of stifling debate, but those who voted UKIP believe that Farage is not PC, which is a massive plus, trumping anything the other parties can offer!
    Silos, tanks, - and much more! www.mickmoor.co.uk

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by danseyspass View Post
    subsidies mean you are paying more for fertiliser, machinery, seeds, rent, mortgage payments, vehicles, fuel etc etc.
    plus you have all the costs of compliance.

    better without, and lets see who can really farm.
    I can farm no bother it's more about facts and figures than "hard graft" get someone else to do the work for less then you can just use your brains not your hands

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by oldoaktree View Post
    I can farm no bother it's more about facts and figures than "hard graft" get someone else to do the work for less then you can just use your brains not your hands
    If by that remark you mean employ contractors, I think you are not using your brains.
    The contractor has to make a profit, has to get it from somewhere.

    Usually means he takes all yours.

    Jack Caley

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    If by that remark you mean employ contractors, I think you are not using your brains.
    The contractor has to make a profit, has to get it from somewhere.

    Usually means he takes all yours.

    Jack Caley
    What it means is I don't have expensive gear sat in my shed all year round or paying men all year !!!!
    Wake up man I can't afford a new 150hp tractor or want to buy one and all the gear to go with it my gear is about wore out and I'm not buying someone else's shite to spend two days at a time fixing it to use for a week or more then fix it again ! Wearing parts alone cost a fortune these days then fuel down time repairs etc !

  22. #52
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by oldoaktree View Post
    I can farm no bother it's more about facts and figures than "hard graft" get someone else to do the work for less then you can just use your brains not your hands
    I cant see the relevance of this answer to my post.
    My point was who will manage without subsidy?

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by danseyspass View Post
    I cant see the relevance of this answer to my post.
    My point was who will manage without subsidy?
    Subsidy is here to stay get use to it live with it accept it work around it like it or not that's life there's no Utopia coming next year with 20 acer rent 100 acer land price fert at 50 per ton beef sheep prices up milk lads on 50p per lt wheat at 300 per ton and no SFP ! As much as you what it and belly ache about life it ain't going to happen so get your toys back in your pram and chill your bean as my daughter would say .
    If you feel so strongly about things then stand for local gov and work your way up !

  24. #54
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by oldoaktree View Post
    Subsidy is here to stay get use to it live with it accept it work around it like it or not that's life there's no Utopia coming next year with 20 acer rent 100 acer land price fert at 50 per ton beef sheep prices up milk lads on 50p per lt wheat at 300 per ton and no SFP ! As much as you what it and belly ache about life it ain't going to happen so get your toys back in your pram and chill your bean as my daughter would say .
    If you feel so strongly about things then stand for local gov and work your way up !
    Sorry, still cant see the connection.
    Subsidy is NOT here to stay, and the sooner it goes the better in my book.
    what is "100 acer land"

  25. #55
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by danseyspass View Post
    subsidies mean you are paying more for fertiliser, machinery, seeds, rent, mortgage payments, vehicles, fuel etc etc.
    plus you have all the costs of compliance.

    better without, and lets see who can really farm.
    Your saying if subsidies went these items would drop in price ? If they did i would eat my straw hat. Plus im quite happy getting my bonus for farming for now thanks.

  26. #56
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by danseyspass View Post
    Sorry, still cant see the connection.
    Subsidy is NOT here to stay, and the sooner it goes the better in my book.
    what is "100 acer land"
    When is subsidy in what ever form it may by called to be stopped then ?
    Read what I wrote 100 acer land price in your Utopian world

  27. #57
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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by danseyspass View Post
    Sorry, still cant see the connection.
    Subsidy is NOT here to stay, and the sooner it goes the better in my book.
    what is "100 acer land"
    I think that EU government will be very reluctant to ditch subsidies. Just think of the new control system coming out now, imposing crop rotation etc, for better or worse. By this means they can threaten and control, we recently had the local footpath man (first name Adolf) threaten us with withdrawal of SFP, there are many other examples
    It will be interesting to see just how much they can reduce it before tell them to stuff it.

    Jack Caley

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by oldoaktree View Post
    What it means is I don't have expensive gear sat in my shed all year round or paying men all year !!!!
    Wake up man I can't afford a new 150hp tractor or want to buy one and all the gear to go with it my gear is about wore out and I'm not buying someone else's shite to spend two days at a time fixing it to use for a week or more then fix it again ! Wearing parts alone cost a fortune these days then fuel down time repairs etc !
    Every farm and business is different, and I would agree that there is a justification for employing a contractor, after all we are contractors ourselves!!
    You hit the nail on the head about expensive gear, but your own gear bought and paid for is a lot cheaper than the expensive gear some contractors have to pay for.
    We once contract farmed a local farm for an institution, I know who made most money out of that farm!!

    Sorry for the digression from the main thread.
    Jack Caley

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    I use contractors where I want to not stubble to stubble ! OSR sowing for instance chap came in with a cat challenger and top down did nearly 100 acres in 8 hrs that would have taken me 4/5 days to plough work down drill roll etc it also meant I could get on with last years bumper wheat harvest ! Thinking if getting someone else in this year with a sumo DTS drill one pass system for a lot less than I could do it for and there is no way I could justify the cost of the drill

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    Re: UKIP & the Euro Elections

    Quote Originally Posted by Derky View Post
    Your saying if subsidies went these items would drop in price ? If they did i would eat my straw hat. Plus im quite happy getting my bonus for farming for now thanks.
    So, just to be clear, you're happy to get a free handout at the taxpayers' expense, but you think that people who get income support because they're unemployed are scroungers? How does that work, exactly?

    Quote Originally Posted by Derky View Post
    The Best way to control mass immigration would be to cut the riduculous benefits system we have in this country. If your lazy on the dole you should get enough cash for a tin of beans and thats it. Go and look for work. The reason the immigrants are coming in is to fill jobs that many of the lazy brits dont want. There is entire towns of 1st and 2nd generation families thinking its exceptable to do F all all day and get money for it.

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