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Thread: Round vs Square

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    Round vs Square

    Currently baling around 2500-3000 5x4 round bales of straw per year and now considering a square baler either 120x70 or 120x90 bale size. Just wondering the pros and cons ie Output, bale weight, running costs, horsepower (jd6150r available). I know the bales would need to be cleared asap but we do that anyway. Thanks
    Nothing runs like a Deere apart from a Limmy!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Square bails do tend to have more advantages than disadvantages....
    If you store them inside they utilize space better, but if outside you will need to make a rick, put a sheet over the big stack basically.... where as rounds would be fine just up against the hedge and forgotten about.

    Regarding running cost they generally are cheap to run but are very expensive in the first place, you could get a spanking machine for the same price of an old buggered square bailer... Regarding power as much as you can afford! how ever big a tractor you put on it at some point you will wish you had more guts... we put a JD8335R on our krone 1290HDP2 and ive had that thing on its knees plenty of times, but then again in another swath 150hp would be fine....

    running costs are on par with a round bailer although if the gearbox's go wrong you may aswell scrap the machine... you will get almost 2 round bails in to one 120x90 bail if your banging them up tight.

    If yo go for a smaller bailer to suit your HP size, such as a 120x70 or even down to a 80x90 you might as well stay with rounds for output, price exc.

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    Re: Round vs Square

    As above- fewer bales to store as denser, stack nicer, easier to transport and strap down. String not netwrap, maybe a bit less useful if you want to bed up by hand but thats arguable. Easier and faster to bale too. Need a new flat 8/hawk type grab though.

    Balers are dearer to buy, but a nice MF one from big bale co which is looked after will do you alright, plenty of people out there running big balers on 150hp machines but as mentioned above, soon as you put steep slopes into the equation and ever larger swaths suddenly you can almost throw horses at it.

    Only ever worked with a Krone one, absolute monster of a thing and seemed easy to use for a total baling novice but can't say anything about running costs or reliability.

    Having worked with quadrants and square bales in the field and in the yard bedding cattle with loader or straw chopper etc, I can tell you I'd never bother with rounds if it were my choice.

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    Re: Round vs Square

    We have contractors in to bale our straw as either stringed rounds or quadrants. I'd choose the quadrants any day of the week over rounds if we could guarantee we could clear them up quickly enough. You can be really rough with quadrants in the field too; picking one up and using it to bump a second round so it is square on really speeds up clearance times.

    All of our straw is stored indoors with rounds baled when the weather is catchy. We pick rounds up with an 8 foot muck fork on a loader tractor, used to use the same for the quadrants but last year bought a bale catcher with back stop to reduce the risk of the top of a pair of quadrants rolling on to the tractor during stacking. No idea on hp, our contractors run huge tractors though and the speed that they can bale our straw rows is frightening.
    Stay in Northamptonshire - meadowviewcottages.co.uk

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    Re: Round vs Square

    The two machines are poles apart and it must largely depend on budget, power available, storage, ability to shift bales fairly quickly from the field and if selling off farm.

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    Re: Round vs Square

    One advantage I can think of is less hassle on slopes (would have to be very talented to get a square bale to roll off into a fence )
    I've only used a round baler and small conventional baler, one thing I like about the small baler is with a power shift gearbox and as it's a non-stop process as well (no stopping to net) you don't have to touch the clutch nearly all day.

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    Re: Round vs Square

    We went from 3000 5ft rounds to 120x90 squares 2yrs ago due to baler breakdown and weather, would never ever go back. Moved to a shred a bale on telehandler, use about 30% less straw, spend 50% less time hauling straw, get 80% of my straw in the barn instead of about 40%. Only down side in my eyes is the need to clear them out the field before it rains unlike a round which will handle a bit more rain on them! In my opinion you will never look back. Easier to put and keep sheet on outside as well !!!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    with a 120x 70 you should get 3 bales to the ton with 8 footers and behind a decent sized combine in reasonable fields with 200hp you can bale 100 bales/hr

    can load 5 high on trailer

    would go for new holland balers personally,

    knotters are the most important thing to consider, nh baler manuals have very good fault finding section

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Ive been hankering after a quadrant baler, but will be looking at the lower end of the market. The thing that puts me off is servicing an old big square baler, any fool can keep a round baler going but there must be more of an art to these as the big users have someone like big bale co go through them each season, I will only be doing 1500-2000 so not sure it would warrant a pros time each season, or have I got it all wrong and the old ones are easy to keep going, much quicker safer carting is the attraction to me

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    Re: Round vs Square

    i only use strraw but prefer squares to round for storage handling and use,the straw i bought this year has been chopped in the baler,is this a new developement. bales are heavier 310kg compared to 350kg 8x4x3. very easily managed in the diet feeder because already chopped,only down side is they fall apart easily when opened in shed

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Somebody told me today to be carefull when looking 2nd hand as even the tidiest of balers can be dodgy. Is it true that the chamber's wear out to the point of the metal being paper thin and if so can it be sorted or re-lined or something. I know of a 187 coming up but have been told its bale chamber is getting thin.
    Nothing runs like a Deere apart from a Limmy!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Just been talking to my Sq baler contractor , they reckon sq baler lasts a hell of a lot longer than round ones

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Quote Originally Posted by charlieboy View Post
    Ive been hankering after a quadrant baler, but will be looking at the lower end of the market. The thing that puts me off is servicing an old big square baler, any fool can keep a round baler going but there must be more of an art to these as the big users have someone like big bale co go through them each season, I will only be doing 1500-2000 so not sure it would warrant a pros time each season, or have I got it all wrong and the old ones are easy to keep going, much quicker safer carting is the attraction to me
    If a low use machine is professionally serviced one year then cleaned up at the end of the season, basic oil and lube checks and replace anything obvious then you ought to go through the following season or possibly 2 with out much hassle? (and stored under cover)

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Quote Originally Posted by Farmer Colin View Post
    Square bails do tend to have more advantages than disadvantages....
    If you store them inside they utilize space better, but if outside you will need to make a rick, put a sheet over the big stack basically.... where as rounds would be fine just up against the hedge and forgotten about.

    Regarding running cost they generally are cheap to run but are very expensive in the first place, you could get a spanking machine for the same price of an old buggered square bailer... Regarding power as much as you can afford! how ever big a tractor you put on it at some point you will wish you had more guts... we put a JD8335R on our krone 1290HDP2 and ive had that thing on its knees plenty of times, but then again in another swath 150hp would be fine....

    running costs are on par with a round bailer although if the gearbox's go wrong you may aswell scrap the machine... you will get almost 2 round bails in to one 120x90 bail if your banging them up tight.

    If yo go for a smaller bailer to suit your HP size, such as a 120x70 or even down to a 80x90 you might as well stay with rounds for output, price exc.



    An HDP2? Word had it that only 1 was coming to the UK for 2014 harvest.....

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Opinions please. Went to see a welger d6006 and d6060 working today. They look like good machines and simple to operate and maintain. What does everyone think?
    Nothing runs like a Deere apart from a Limmy!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Quote Originally Posted by sodbuster View Post
    Opinions please. Went to see a welger d6006 and d6060 working today. They look like good machines and simple to operate and maintain. What does everyone think?
    Watch the packers on them, and the packer shafts. Also the electric trip solenoid can be temperamental on them. Check the pick up cams, they have a tendency to shear off if they haven't been oiled, not a huge job, but it's a days work. The oiler drinks like a fish, the on,y way to stop it is to turn off the knotter fans.... The knitters are reliable, but they just need to be cleaned regularly, it's only a few mins with a 17mm ratchet spanner. Depending on how new you are looking at, they changed from a rotor shear bolt to a rotor knock out clutch, IMO the bolt is a better design for the baler, but the clutch, now the shaft is supported from then end.

    My experience is from a D4006 (2006 model) and D4006 (2011 model)

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Getting a bit further down this road now just need a few questions answered please. What are the basic running costs on an 8x4x2? How much is a ball of string and how many bales to a ball? Anything else?
    Nothing runs like a Deere apart from a Limmy!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    BUMP.
    Nothing runs like a Deere apart from a Limmy!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Quote Originally Posted by sodbuster View Post
    Getting a bit further down this road now just need a few questions answered please. What are the basic running costs on an 8x4x2? How much is a ball of string and how many bales to a ball? Anything else?
    How longs a piece of string.........?
    6 Knotter machine ??
    Amount of string for 6 string bale @ 8ft length = 8+8+2+2 * 6 = 120ft per bale.

    Price Depends on when and how many balls you buy, better discount by the pallet load, and the spec of the string (kg/m).

    FS

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Quote Originally Posted by Flyingscotsman View Post
    How longs a piece of string.........?
    6 Knotter machine ??
    Amount of string for 6 string bale @ 8ft length = 8+8+2+2 * 6 = 120ft per bale.

    Price Depends on when and how many balls you buy, better discount by the pallet load, and the spec of the string (kg/m).

    FS
    Just looking for a good average cost per bale that's all
    Nothing runs like a Deere apart from a Limmy!

  21. #21
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    Re: Round vs Square

    As an end user - (don't bale anything myself) Straw I always have in square bales

    Hay and Silage ALWAYS better in round bales! I know its a pain to handle them, but you just can't get the same consistent quality of the feed in square bales especially wrapped ones....

    I would love to be proven wrong!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    i know nothing about balers but do some balers have a chopper/shredder in them

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Quote Originally Posted by zsnotdead View Post
    i know nothing about balers but do some balers have a chopper/shredder in them
    Some Round balers have knives/blades on a roller on the pickup to make "chopped" bales, is that what you mean?

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Quote Originally Posted by Einstien View Post
    Some Round balers have knives/blades on a roller on the pickup to make "chopped" bales, is that what you mean?
    no, i mean the large square balers,i bought some straw this year and the large bales were chopped,easier to bed with and great in the diet feeder

  25. #25
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    Smile Re: Round vs Square

    Quote Originally Posted by zsnotdead View Post
    no, i mean the large square balers,i bought some straw this year and the large bales were chopped,easier to bed with and great in the diet feeder
    yes they do, definitely been out for a year at least (saw a new NH with it), most likley they've been out for longer (don't know personal)
    All my tractors are treated like dog's.......the pedigree show variety

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    Re: Round vs Square

    I would imagine same sort of thing - some sort of tyne/knife on the way in, you can't cut too much before baling, or the bale would fall apart!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Nobody know roughly how much it costs to make a 120x70 bale in average conditions?????
    Nothing runs like a Deere apart from a Limmy!

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    Re: Round vs Square

    Thoughts please on a Vicon lb12-200 big baler
    Nothing runs like a Deere apart from a Limmy!

  29. #29

    Re: Round vs Square

    I have run several different square balers,inc vicon mp 800/cb8080 , two krone 8080's a krone 890 a hesston 4790 (mf187 in hesston colours) and have just bought a MF 2170 ,the vicons were ok but feeble they did not like stuffing the top of the bales very well ,I would not have another one!,The early krones were absolute animals with a ferocious apetite ,the first one was a friday afternooner and loved bailing parts of itself up especially the needles three times! the second one of theese was good then the krone 890 I only ran for one season as I had more demand for 120 wide bales so I bought a 1999 hesston 4790 this has done 5 seasons for me and has been fantastic they are a bit like triggers broom just look after them by replacing parts as needed, my parts bill for 2014 season was less than 400 ,I have now bought the massey ferguson 2170 for the coming season ,My 4790 is for sale if this would be of intrest! and is on Ebay at the moment http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3016324333...84.m1555.l2649

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