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Thread: 135 - PTO and hydraulics - very strange symptoms....

  1. #1
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    135 - PTO and hydraulics - very strange symptoms....

    Hi there,

    don't know if anyone can shed a light on this before I start to pull things apart please.


    I have this 1969 mulipower 135 which I have recently started to use on an old fingerbar hedgetrimmer - the first real PTO/hydraulic work I have used it for in several years of non problemmatic ownership.

    Initially, it was knocking quite a bit on lifting but having rebuilt the leaking diverter valve, the knocking is greatly reduced although still present at times

    There has been an ongoing issue with PTO engagement which I was hoping to leave until I finished the bit of trimming I have left. There are two snags - the first being that having engaged the ground drive PTO option, it has been extremely reluctant to come out of it even with no loading on the drive chain - the lever seems fairly well jammed in ground speed position although by rocking the tractor forward and backwards, it would always come out eventually; the second being that there doesn't really seem to be enough movement on the lever to ensure the PTO is fully engaged in engine drive position - it certainly doesnt seem to be reaching the detent position. I was guessing (hoping) this will just be a snag with the selector fork or mechanism but....... and here comes the really strange thing ... when I was shifting the tractor out of the way today, it now appears there is a linked hydraulic funny ......

    .... until now, I have had no problems whatsoever with position control on this tractor yet today, whenever I try to get the PTO into engine drive, the hydraulic arms just lift of their own volition from whereever they happen to be set. I just don't get this at all!!!!!! It is not just a one off, it happens everytime - whenever any pressure is applied to the PTO lever towards the engine drive option, the arms lift even with the pto clutch disengaged......


    I cannot for the life of me see how, but I am now wondering if the two problems are linked (and whether they are linked to the ongoing pump knocking noise although this noise sounds more like the characteristic massey relief valve knock and mat be a red herring). I have never had the gearbox/back axle apart in one of these to begion to guess a cause and was wondering if any Massey experts might be able to shine a little light please.


    Thanks

    David

  2. #2
    Senior Member MF-ANDY's Avatar
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    Re: 135 - PTO and hydraulics - very strange symptoms....

    my guess is that you have very worn or broken dowel pegs. these are pegs, one each side low down below and just in front of the two side covers held in with two 5/16" unf nuts that engage with holes in the hydraulic pump to locate it. the knocking sound you hear is the pump rattling about when its pumping. i would think as you try to engage the engine speed pto you are forcing the pump foward and moving the pump control valve linkage away from the control arm which is putting the control valve into lift. the side covers can be removed to check for damage on the pto selector gear and the dowel pegs can be removed, after you drain the oil.

  3. #3
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    Re: 135 - PTO and hydraulics - very strange symptoms....

    Thanks Andy.

    Do I remember correctly reading somewhere that there are two different sizes for these dowels with later models having larger dowels?

    I guess I have to hope that it is just the dowels worn and not the pump body!!!!

    Cheers

    David

  4. #4
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    Re: 135 - PTO and hydraulics - very strange symptoms....

    So it turns out that the previous owner hadn't bothered with the retaining wire on the strainer assembly - I found the mangled remains of filter and end caps in the bottom of the gearbox/axle casting.

    It was these that were fouling the sliding pto drive gear.

    Managed to get a new filter assembly from Agriline - had a panic that it initially appeared to be unavailable, not listed under 135 stock but, it appears that the 165 uses the same assembly (fingers crossed - the filter is the same part number so hopfully the end caps are likewise interchangeable).

    Not sure it explains the spontaneous lifting business, have ordered up a couple of pump dowels anyway - but with luck, all should be well in a day or two.

    Cheers

    David
    Last edited by DavidB; 18-02-15 at 03:41 PM.

  5. #5
    Senior Member MF-ANDY's Avatar
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    Re: 135 - PTO and hydraulics - very strange symptoms....

    maybe a piece of filter housing was jamming on the control valve linkage causing it to lift

  6. #6
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    Re: 135 - PTO and hydraulics - very strange symptoms....

    Hi Andy

    Now I''ve pulled off wheel and mudguard, I can see in there properly - not only does the strainer need replacing, but there is a brass sleeve loose on the pump output shaft which looks like it should be located in the rear of the pump. Presumably it is just an interferance fit in the pump housing so do you reckon I will get away with tapping it back into place (sort of flush with the end of the pump) or do I really need to remove lift cover and pump?

    If I do have to remove the lift cover, do I actually need any of these special tools the manual talks about, do I have to perform ALL the external and internal set up procedures and are there any 'gotcha' things to be aware of please?


    Thanks

    David

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    Senior Member MF-ANDY's Avatar
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    Re: 135 - PTO and hydraulics - very strange symptoms....

    If you can clean the housing and bush with some brake cleaner then apply a little loctite I would try tapping it back in. You wont need special tools to remove the top cover but you will to do the adjustments. The roller on the control valve lever will need to be removed before you lift the top cover.

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