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Thread: Grainstore lights

  1. #1
    Senior Member Footsfitter's Avatar
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    Grainstore lights

    Had 3 grain stores with elderly Tungsten Halogen 1000w and 1500w lamps to replace recently. They had been purchased some years ago when it became a requirement to have glass lamp lenses protected with safety film but it was never successful given the heat the TH lamp throws out, most would quickly end up crinkled and discoloured severely reducing the light output.

    Having a dozen or so to do and the chance to move to LED made me wonder about using lamps we had already been using around the farm that I get from a local electrical supplier and applying the film ourselves. For the safety film I hunted around on Ebay and found a nice supplier from "oop north" who supplied a sq metre of the thickish anti-vandal stuff for under a tenner! Came with instructions on how to apply it and after the first one it soon became easy.

    I traced round a glass and cut them out to size as opposed to the guide- made it easier to apply - you make up "slip" AKA soapy water and use it to clean the glass, then using a bit of sticky tape to peel off the backing film you spray slip on the film and glass, then get the film on the glass quickly, the guide advises using a plastic squeegee but I found that a rubber roller used for PVC sheet welding good to squeeze the film of slip out, once done it was easiest to put the glass back in the frame and into the lamp, the frame covers the film edges and holds it while you polish the film (some of the old TH lamps didn't and a broken glass merely fell out!!).

    Lamps came from www.tlc-direct.co.uk looks like they are their "own" brand made in China like everything nowadays. They are COB LED's- ChipOnBoard apparently? Used 50w units as the barns are a bit too wide for the normal 30w I use to replace 500w TH lamps. The light is a lot brighter/whiter IYKWIM, The end picture has one lamp above the doorway and the second one you can see the light overflowing up onto the roof where is is halfway in. Originally there were Thorn 1500W enclosed TH lamps which were brighter when new but with age both the reflectors and glass/film made them easily 50% less than new, plus like all TH lamps the contact arms that hold the tube ends suffer from heat & corrosion in a vicious circle as they get older too.

    The new lamps run much cooler and the film coating should last much longer as well as being more secure being clamped between the front frame and the bodys silicone seal

    Purchased the film from here- http://tinyurl.com/odwf24n


    Last edited by Footsfitter; 27-02-17 at 09:35 PM.

  2. #2
    Senior Member 4wd's Avatar
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    Re: Grainstore lights

    LEDs are certainly affordable now and well worth considering for any new or replacement.
    I don't mind them in the house either, much better light quality than low energy CF bulbs even for reading fine print.
    The warmer shade might be more suitable in a lamp.

    Remains to be seem how long they'll last in harsh outdoor situations like livestock sheds though.
    The little floodlight units do feel quite chunky and robust.
    I do like how they are instantly full brightness too.

  3. #3
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    Re: Grainstore lights

    Quote Originally Posted by 4wd View Post
    LEDs are certainly affordable now and well worth considering for any new or replacement.
    I don't mind them in the house either, much better light quality than low energy CF bulbs even for reading fine print.
    The warmer shade might be more suitable in a lamp.

    Remains to be seem how long they'll last in harsh outdoor situations like livestock sheds though.
    The little floodlight units do feel quite chunky and robust.
    I do like how they are instantly full brightness too.
    We've had a 3 bulb light fitting on the landing at home which over the years has blown its fair share of normal G9 bulbs, I hoped that moving to LED bulbs might calm it down a bit. All it's done is make the bulb eating habits of the fitting a lot more expensive!! LED's are great when they are working but frustrating when they don't get near the advertised life.
    Stay in Northamptonshire - meadowviewcottages.co.uk

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    Senior Member Footsfitter's Avatar
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    Re: Grainstore lights

    Quote Originally Posted by foxbox View Post
    We've had a 3 bulb light fitting on the landing at home which over the years has blown its fair share of normal G9 bulbs, I hoped that moving to LED bulbs might calm it down a bit. All it's done is make the bulb eating habits of the fitting a lot more expensive!! LED's are great when they are working but frustrating when they don't get near the advertised life.

    Replaced seven 500w TH floodlights around the main farmhouse with the 30w versions used in the grainstore mainly because of reliability but the electric saving wasn't to be sniffed at, later I had the all the internal recessed 50mm reflector TH spots replaced because after 15 years the lamps short flex had perished from their extreme heat so they were becoming a fire risk. Replaced them with LV LED but they haven't lasted too well- there was an upstairs water leak and the kitchen ones didn't take too kindly to the water! although the on the plus side, in the summer the kitchen is a lot cooler surprisingly and I think the electric bill is less- they replaced over 75 of them throughout the farmhouse

  5. #5
    Senior Member ladycrofter's Avatar
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    Re: Grainstore lights

    Any update on the LED floodlights? We need to put some more light in the shed but I am wary of buying LED, granted they have some a long way. I would be needing each one to reasonably light a 20' x 40' section.

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    Senior Member Footsfitter's Avatar
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    Re: Grainstore lights

    Quote Originally Posted by ladycrofter View Post
    Any update on the LED floodlights? We need to put some more light in the shed but I am wary of buying LED, granted they have some a long way. I would be needing each one to reasonably light a 20' x 40' section.
    The 50w leds in the grain stores produce acceptable light for what we require although you wouldn't want to do a really fiddly job in there without extra lighting but then they are pretty wide and deep barns. the light seems very sharp and white with sharp shadows perhaps a result of the reflectors being plain whereas the old fashioned halogen use a dimpled reflector that scatters light and softens shadow outlines?

    For use in harvest time and general stuff in the grain stores they seem a good compromise, 100% reliability so far and their running cost has to be a big winner. I'd go for ones with cooling fins on the outside similar to what we had from TLC as although these LEDs floodlights seem to run cooler I have had problems with the circuit board/chip burning out on a household replacement bulb application where there is no ability to keep their running temperature down because of the bulb design limiting it.

    If your unsure then just get hold of one single 30w lamp and try it wired in on an extension lead and clamp it temporarily in place.

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    Re: Grainstore lights

    Quote Originally Posted by ladycrofter View Post
    Any update on the LED floodlights? We need to put some more light in the shed but I am wary of buying LED, granted they have some a long way. I would be needing each one to reasonably light a 20' x 40' section.
    Have you thought about LED Corn Lamps?

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    Re: Grainstore lights

    These might be a good option for your grain store applications, optical polycarbonate cover lens, therefore no glass. 210watt producing 24000 lumens
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    Re: Grainstore lights

    Have just registered. The day job involves saving energy for large corporates, which includes LED. Though I would contribute have had some useful advice from the forum on other things.

    Lumens = total light output
    Watts = total power drawn
    Lumens/Watt = efficiency of the LED light (they aren't all the same).

    Suggest you look at Luxonic Hi-Max range (no I don't work for them). Class leading efficiency of 152lumens/watt (the one above is 114lumens/W). This has two benefits - better efficiency means cheaper to run and also less heat produced for the same light output. Less heat output enables a better life span.

    The HiMax's can be IP rated (and even ATEX approved) if required, 5-year warranty. They output 12,500 lumens up to 41,000 lumens.
    IP65 has a polycarbonate lens.
    They can be set-up to dim based on a PIR (or go off) which costs very little extra which if you wander off can save a lot over a year.
    We use the PIR and daylight sensors and can save 25% on busy sites. You may well save a lot more with these features unless you are diligent at turning off lights (none of the farmers I know are)

    Sure they cost a bit more but we regularly test the market and Luxonic seem to be top of the tree at the moment.

    Hope this helps.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Footsfitter's Avatar
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    Re: Grainstore lights

    Quote Originally Posted by FootSore View Post
    Have just registered. The day job involves saving energy for large corporates, which includes LED. Though I would contribute have had some useful advice from the forum on other things.

    Lumens = total light output
    Watts = total power drawn
    Lumens/Watt = efficiency of the LED light (they aren't all the same).

    Suggest you look at Luxonic Hi-Max range (no I don't work for them). Class leading efficiency of 152lumens/watt (the one above is 114lumens/W). This has two benefits - better efficiency means cheaper to run and also less heat produced for the same light output. Less heat output enables a better life span.

    The HiMax's can be IP rated (and even ATEX approved) if required, 5-year warranty. They output 12,500 lumens up to 41,000 lumens.
    IP65 has a polycarbonate lens.
    They can be set-up to dim based on a PIR (or go off) which costs very little extra which if you wander off can save a lot over a year.
    We use the PIR and daylight sensors and can save 25% on busy sites. You may well save a lot more with these features unless you are diligent at turning off lights (none of the farmers I know are)

    Sure they cost a bit more but we regularly test the market and Luxonic seem to be top of the tree at the moment.

    Hope this helps.

    never looked into Luxonic for LED's but know of the name- they're next door to the area HSE office on the ring-road on our side of town! Might have to find out if Luxonic supply direct out the back door
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  11. #11
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    Re: Grainstore lights

    Quote Originally Posted by Footsfitter View Post
    never looked into Luxonic for LED's but know of the name- they're next door to the area HSE office on the ring-road on our side of town! Might have to find out if Luxonic supply direct out the back door
    I've not been to their Basingstoke Office but they have some of the fun test kit, to measure light output at Basingstoke.

    There is a lot of substandard stuff available from no name manufacturers which gives LED a bad name. Plus some have an unusual expectation - see fox box below who thought that a fitting that was eating G9s would somehow be fixed with LED. I suspect some sort of fault with the fitting or the supply - I would look at what else is on that circuit - any fluorescents? Some of them make nasty neighbours due to inherent faults.

    And yes less heat - they are more efficient! All the energy ends up as heat. In a standard bulb some 90% is direct heat, the rest is light, which when it reaches the end of its journey becomes heat. LED uses 90%-ish less energy so just 10%. If it was 100% efficient it would not get hot (they aren't) so some heat is produced, the light returns to heat at the end of its journey. The heat may not be noticeable but you can't destroy energy just change its form.

    We did a large high fashion retailer and it removed 18kW of heat source from the store. Then we had to re-optimise the HVAC, and add a heating element as it had never needed heating even in winter!

    So in your farmhouse 75*50=3750w which at 90% heat = 3.375kW = 1 fan heater of heater
    LED at 5W = 375W so you have lost a fan heater.

    Even 20*50W is equivalent to a 1kW heater which if left running is quite a lot of heat.
    And yes lower energy bills to boot.

    We are a small holiday complex and have some 315 light bulbs across the site (all LED) the max light load when we started was 19kW and is now 2.1kW - quite a difference.

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