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Thread: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

  1. #61
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by WoodenHead View Post
    Edit 09.19: Zaza you type quicker than me! And do you always know what I'm thinking
    Spookey or what ? We'd better be careful or people will start talking. You know what Internet forums are like for gossip. But seriously, we do appear to agree over the approval issue.

  2. #62
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    I may be wrong...but requiring New members to be approved prevents ?? "Bots" ?? Is that the right term? From killing the forum site stone dead by overloading the system.
    Automated destruction in another phrase.
    Bit like having to type in the random letters/Numbers shown in the box below as shown on some pages when sending an email enquiry from a we page. Just a way of stopping nasty people from doing nasty things.
    One particular individual is responsible for the neutering of forum content not the forum management by choice. He took on the forum and in effect backed up by the threat of punitive legal action he won!
    The result of this was that Section entitled Agricultural Matters had to be severely restricted to Agricultural Matters only
    It was a very very sad day. The pleasure of hundreds if not thousands was denied to give one individual theirs.
    As I said in an earlier thread I am choosing my words very carefully.
    In short two events in the history of the forum are the major turning points .......The first is above and the second was the Virus / Troll / Hacker attack, followed by the opportunistic young bucks actions.
    From Blues point of view....if it was me, it would be very easy to sit back and think why do I bother? All of us have our lives to live.....some of us for altruistic reasons choose to put back a little more than we take out. Blue to me was / is one of those people.
    Yes there was some money to be made.......but......I presume hardly "Lets go and live in the Carribean stuff!"
    So are we in a situation where the forum is being allowed to slowly die away rather than for someone to actually switch it off.
    Anyway that is how I see things.

  3. #63
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Yes, normally forums like this use automatic registration validation where by you register on site and the site automatically mails a message to the email you registered with containing an activation link, as you say, you can add an extra layer by using the cpacha squiggly line things or by having a set question like 'what colour s the sky' just to prove that it's a real person, not a bot, registering. TBH if a forum like, say, the army rumour service can get away with that sort of registration set up and not be swamped in spam then this place could.

    I think the manual validation of accounts here was, in the past, as much to do with limiting the size and expansion of th forum to a size that could be managed as a volunteer operation. BFF in full flow with the off topic section would have been a monster to manage, i'd imagine.

    I don't think this forum will be in danger of being oversubscribed any time soon, but with a bit of attention it could be reasonably busy again, though if it were i don't see it presenting the sort of moderation challenges there were in the past for the simple reason that all the trolls and attention seekers have gone elsewhere in search of a bigger audience for their tantrums.

    I can see why it was necessary to manage registrations in the past but i can't see that it's still necessary now, and having a defacto embargo on new members joining is pretty much a death sentence for the forum, and there's not much point in any of us stalwarts trying to revitalise the place while that is the case.

    I've sent a message to blue asking him to join us here and discuss the matter with us, it may take a while for him to receive it and get back to us, but hopefully he will in good time. Ultimately, this is his forum, and it's his decision as to how it is managed going forward. I'd like to see this place survive and prosper but if Blue wishes to leave it as it is as a resource for the existing old members then we have to respect his decision. The ball is in his court so we'll just have to wait and see what he says.

  4. #64
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    I don't know what the hierarchy of this forum is and joined after the ex/implosion a few years ago, it doesn't bother me what or who the people at the top are and I thank them for providing this means of discussion and help. I joined cos I was looking for an answer to a specific question and got that and many more since. Thanks to all who have helped me and I hope I have helped others too. I'm not on any other forums but have clicked on a few links in the past, to what some refer to as the other side, and not been able to read the detail as I'm not a member. This may or nor be normal for said site but doesn't entice me to join up and use it. I give my sincere thanks to all those involved in the running of this forum for providing us with an easy means of communication with people all over the world and reading other peoples point of view can be quite educational. That all said it is definitely a lot quieter on here recently than a year ago and beyond. Long live the BFF!
    🚜🚜🚜🚜🚜

  5. #65
    Senior Member WoodenHead's Avatar
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    I've sent a message to blue asking him to join us here and discuss the matter with us, it may take a while for him to receive it and get back to us, but hopefully he will in good time. Ultimately, this is his forum, and it's his decision as to how it is managed going forward. I'd like to see this place survive and prosper but if Blue wishes to leave it as it is as a resource for the existing old members then we have to respect his decision. The ball is in his court so we'll just have to wait and see what he says.
    Thanks v much mbj, I think that may be the answer we're seeking.........Just so's we know where we are

    WH
    Money isn't everything - but it sure helps to keep the children in touch

  6. #66
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    In short two events in the history of the forum are the major turning points .......The first is above and the second was the Virus / Troll / Hacker attack, followed by the opportunistic young bucks actions.
    .
    think it was the oppertunistic young bucks that came first

  7. #67
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    All that is needed is the first post to be a proper post, you would be amazed how many are just links to pornographic or phishing websites. The forum I am a mod on does not vet people per se we just try to have a clean forum.

  8. #68
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by Recycled View Post
    think it was the oppertunistic young bucks that came first
    Not on the time line!

  9. #69
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by Barney View Post
    All that is needed is the first post to be a proper post, you would be amazed how many are just links to pornographic or phishing websites. The forum I am a mod on does not vet people per se we just try to have a clean forum.
    Another forum I go to (non-farming) has that kind of problem - people can sign up and immediately post a number of "posts". It is not uncommon to have more "P o r n" sites or "P i l l s" or . . . than valid content every day - most from "first time" posters. this includes "character sets" unknown to me and the list goes on.

    It is a balancing act - too open and you get "dumped on" - too closed and you get "dumped on" in a different way

    Just my nickel and a half

  10. #70
    Senior Member WoodenHead's Avatar
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    I've sent a message to blue asking him to join us here and discuss the matter with us, it may take a while for him to receive it and get back to us, but hopefully he will in good time. Ultimately, this is his forum, and it's his decision as to how it is managed going forward. I'd like to see this place survive and prosper but if Blue wishes to leave it as it is as a resource for the existing old members then we have to respect his decision. The ball is in his court so we'll just have to wait and see what he says.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoodenHead View Post
    Thanks v much mbj, I think that may be the answer we're seeking.........Just so's we know where we are

    WH

    mbj - your pm inbox is full
    Money isn't everything - but it sure helps to keep the children in touch

  11. #71
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by WoodenHead View Post
    mbj - your pm inbox is full
    oops, deleted some now

  12. #72
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    I was not aware of any legal difficulties that occurred in the history of the forum?

    Speaking of the forum on which I used to play a active staff role, we had a variety of instances where content was unreservedly deleted because of potential legal ramifications of what it contained? As I understood it, the forum and staff involved could theoretically be held responsible for content they 'allowed' to be distributed through their system, and so the automatic response was to just delete anything that might be even slightly libellous, etc and basically try to 'ban' it from being posted in the first instance?

    I thought this was basically the usual legal guidelines upon which interactive media operated? Although one can only imagine at the legalities of something like facebook or worse, twitter, where of course the first recourse is the 'free speech' claim etc?

  13. #73
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by MC130 View Post
    I just clicked on the 'newest member' down at the bottom of the forum, out of curiosity, and I have to admit I was rather shocked to see there's been no new members joined since September 2014.
    Before TFF, and when BFF was busy, I would contact BFF admin with regards to people who weren't being allowed to join up. They would submit their details etc, then nothing. After a while I eventually got a response that BFF didn't want "too many" foreign members.

    That's fine, but people can't turn around and express surprise or dismay with policies like that. The people I was trying to represent were all quality posters elsewhere, not a trouble maker among them. Put me right off BFF and that was way in advance of TFF ever being heard of.

  14. #74
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnGalway View Post
    Before TFF, and when BFF was busy, I would contact BFF admin with regards to people who weren't being allowed to join up. They would submit their details etc, then nothing. After a while I eventually got a response that BFF didn't want "too many" foreign members.

    That's fine, but people can't turn around and express surprise or dismay with policies like that. The people I was trying to represent were all quality posters elsewhere, not a trouble maker among them. Put me right off BFF and that was way in advance of TFF ever being heard of.
    Yeah, i remember that. the problem was that BFF was a victim of its own success back then, more people wanted to join than a forum run by volunteers could handle, remember that the other place has employed people full time to run the forum, it's not necessarily a like for like comparison because the place is run on a more commercial footing but it gives an idea of how big BFF could have potentially have been if they'd opened the floodgates. I'm not saying no doing so was the correct decision, but it's understandable that someone running a forum as a sort of public service wouldn't want the responsibility of employing people and running a business that would then have to generate enough income to service a big wage bill. I would stress that's just my opinion, i don't know it to be the case but it does seem to fit with what happened.

  15. #75
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by Uwork4menow View Post
    I was not aware of any legal difficulties that occurred in the history of the forum?

    Speaking of the forum on which I used to play a active staff role, we had a variety of instances where content was unreservedly deleted because of potential legal ramifications of what it contained? As I understood it, the forum and staff involved could theoretically be held responsible for content they 'allowed' to be distributed through their system, and so the automatic response was to just delete anything that might be even slightly libellous, etc and basically try to 'ban' it from being posted in the first instance?

    I thought this was basically the usual legal guidelines upon which interactive media operated? Although one can only imagine at the legalities of something like facebook or worse, twitter, where of course the first recourse is the 'free speech' claim etc?
    The libel laws in the UK are quite onerous, in the US people are protected by first amendment rights and can say much more (hence the Tom, Cruise puppet in the infamous 'Tom Cruise is in the closet' episode of South Park saying "I'm going to sue you in England).

    That said, it's incredibly expensive to actually sue someone for libel, it would preclude most of us from doing so even if we had a good case, so libel laws tend to disproportionately favour the wealthy. The late Lord Macalpine was able to successfully sue Sally Bercow and Monbiot for tweeting the False story from Newsnight alleging he was a paedophile. All Bewcow said was 'why is lord macalpine trending? innocent face'. both backed down and settled out of court as the costs of defending would have been astronomical. As the man said, it would take a heart of stone not to laugh at that one. Note macalpine went after individual users, rather than twitter itself

    From a forum point of view, the defence would be that the forum is not pro-actively moderated, ie the mods don't scan posts looking for actionable material, they wait for users to alert them that something dodgy has been posted and then act. Obviously this isn't really the case, mods will be looking for dodgy stuff to pre empt problems, but they say that it is. that way, if someone posts a libel, and the individual libelled complains, they have the defence that they will remove the post in a reasonable time frame, which could be as much as a couple of days. that would protect the forum in most cases, they'd only be a problem if they refused to delete something and the injured party then sued, but again, this is an expensive process, for both sides. basically the forum would b seen as publishing a libel for hosting the offending post, but as long as they responded to a complaint in a reasonable time frame they'd be in the clear.

    however, even though the forum would be in the clear if the post was removed, the individual who posted it could still be pursued by the person libelled. the forum is also a limited company, which means if it was sued, only the company assets would be at risk, they couldn't come after the owners farm or anything if the forum was involved in some legal case and lost, only whatever money was in the company account.

    Again, i'm no legal expert, but that's my understanding of the issue, hope it makes sense.

  16. #76
    Senior Member wr.'s Avatar
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Still no response from Blue?
    Bit like FWi
    Don't itch for something if you're not prepared to scratch for it.

  17. #77
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    In fairness he may not yet have received my message.

  18. #78

    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    [QUOTE=skoda;266949]BFF seems to be more than alive here. https://www.facebook.com/groups/Brit...group_activity


    I don't use Facebook and don't really understand how it works, but being an inquisitive as well as a lazy sod, I sometimes look people up via Google, LinkedIn etc. I did register on Facebook a couple of years ago with a non-de-plume. I followed the link above just now to look at the BFF page, but couldn't see any forum type activity, just people's photos.

    As I say, I don't understand it, or the mentality of the people who want to publicise their lives.

  19. #79
    Senior Member raiderz's Avatar
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    [QUOTE=Lazy Sod;267306]
    Quote Originally Posted by skoda View Post
    BFF seems to be more than alive here. https://www.facebook.com/groups/Brit...group_activity


    I don't use Facebook and don't really understand how it works, but being an inquisitive as well as a lazy sod, I sometimes look people up via Google, LinkedIn etc. I did register on Facebook a couple of years ago with a non-de-plume. I followed the link above just now to look at the BFF page, but couldn't see any forum type activity, just people's photos.

    As I say, I don't understand it, or the mentality of the people who want to publicise their lives.
    You need to join the group to be able to see the posts on it.

  20. #80
    Senior Member skoda's Avatar
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by Lazy Sod View Post
    I don't use Facebook and don't really understand how it works, but being an inquisitive as well as a lazy sod, I sometimes look people up via Google, LinkedIn etc. I did register on Facebook a couple of years ago with a non-de-plume. I followed the link above just now to look at the BFF page, but couldn't see any forum type activity, just people's photos.

    As I say, I don't understand it, or the mentality of the people who want to publicise their lives.
    I don't understand why people publicise their lives when they have nothing to show or say either but there are always exceptions like this that turned up the other day. https://www.facebook.com/rachel.nich...72147576437997 One of the best things I have seen on the internet.

    If BFF facebook page had been around as it is now it would have been very useful when the off topic section on BFF over heated several years ago due to a clash of personalities shall we say ,in giving people other avenues and would have taken the steam out the situations that occurred .There is no denying there is a lot of crap on facebook, but its much quicker to navigate and avoid with the freedom to form small groups of people either close personal friends or like minded people from are far with similar interests and similar sense of humour, avoiding some very sad people with physiological issues who turn up on all popular forums known as Trolls .
    Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, but expecting different results.

  21. #81
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by skoda View Post
    I don't understand why people publicise their lives when they have nothing to show or say either but there are always exceptions like this that turned up the other day. https://www.facebook.com/rachel.nich...72147576437997 One of the best things I have seen on the internet.
    Looking elsewhere it seems not everyone agrees with you.

  22. #82
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    Looking elsewhere it seems not everyone agrees with you.
    Fortunately I cant be bothered searching where.
    Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, but expecting different results.

  23. #83
    Senior Member WoodenHead's Avatar
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by wr. View Post
    Still no response from Blue?
    Bit like FWi
    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    In fairness he may not yet have received my message.

    I've been away - no response I take it....
    and I haven't missed much it seems save Brexit thread
    Money isn't everything - but it sure helps to keep the children in touch

  24. #84
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    It feels like I'm on the Mary Celeste........................................... .................................................. ............................... In the Bermuda triangle.

  25. #85
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    As some of you know a while ago on FF's suggestion i wrote a letter to blue at the forum's accommodation address (where the ltd company that 'owns' the site is registered) asking him to join us on this thread to discuss the future of the forum, that was three weeks ago now, as of today i've had no response.

  26. #86
    Senior Member Footsfitter's Avatar
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    It feels like I'm on the Mary Celeste........................................... .................................................. ............................... In the Bermuda triangle.

    I had that nautical feeling too, Swan River on the Captain Cook to Freo. Didn't quite make open ocean though- disembarked at the port.

  27. #87
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    Well yeah, there is that. It's kind of poor form to criticise our host given that he provides this place for us to use FOC but i think you're right, he has become something of an absentee landlord of late, and perhaps if other commitments are keeping him from giving this place the attention it needs then handing it over to someone who has the time and the vision to move it forward might be a good option, even ceding more control to the mod team so they could tweak the forum operating system to make it a bit more user friendly would be a step forward, but hey ho.

    Things come and go, i noticed the the other day that friends reunited is closing, one of the biggest internet names from the early 2000's, the guy who started it in his back bedroom, sold it on to ITV for something like 171 million, now it's not making enough to cover its running costs.

    I think this place still has a role to play, it's a resource run for the benefit of the users, the other place, for all it's user friendly bells and whistles, is run for the benefit of its owners, to make them money and raise their profile within the industry. There's nothing necessarily wrong with that but it's worth remembering that there are occasions when such an approach could be in conflict with the best interests of the members, or with protecting the image of uk agriculture
    Sorry to go off thread a bit , but it just shows where the moneys being pulled to .
    We are all thinking of the recesson in farming and in the world , yet things that are topical like Facebook ,E Bay , Amazon , Google etc plus betting on line ,bingo or poker are sucking money in like crazy.
    However , if it just dips out of fashion , soon gone !!
    Would be nice to see the old forum get a bit of an uplift , because falling postings , can be a one way street

  28. #88
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    As some of you know a while ago on FF's suggestion i wrote a letter to blue at the forum's accommodation address (where the ltd company that 'owns' the site is registered) asking him to join us on this thread to discuss the future of the forum, that was three weeks ago now, as of today i've had no response.
    Any reply?
    Or isn't he interested any more???

  29. #89
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by J B View Post
    Any reply?
    Or isn't he interested any more???
    No, there's been no reply i'm afraid.

    the only other thing i can suggest is that the moderators contact him themselves and say that they're not prepared to run the forum in his absence unless he gives them full editing powers, there's nothing to lose at this point as far as i see it.

  30. #90
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    Re: I don't like it..... It's too damn quiet

    Quote Originally Posted by Huffy View Post
    Sorry to go off thread a bit , but it just shows where the moneys being pulled to .
    We are all thinking of the recesson in farming and in the world , yet things that are topical like Facebook ,E Bay , Amazon , Google etc plus betting on line ,bingo or poker are sucking money in like crazy.
    However , if it just dips out of fashion , soon gone !!
    Would be nice to see the old forum get a bit of an uplift , because falling postings , can be a one way street
    Good point. When you think how little profit, if any, there is in farming today, for a job that is fundamental to the continuation of civilisation really, everyone's got to eat, yet we're working for pennies an hour and treated like second class citizens, whilst things that no one really needs are raking in millions. it's a funny old world.

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