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Thread: Robot Milking - (All)

  1. #1
    Yorkshire Farmer
    Guest

    Robot Milking - (All)

    Been suggested by a couple of people to me that 1 thread on Robots in general would be easier to follow on here, and then where there are specific questions on one brand or another leave them questions for those threads?? what do others think?

    To kick it off here is a research doccument from Denmark. It notes that 880 herd are milked there with AMS - Automatic Milking Systems.

    This research is into the well overlooked energy and water consumptions of various makes of AMS machines on the market and in use in Denmark:

    It finds on electric alone there is a cost from between 30 / cow / year up to 61.5 / cow/yr

    quite a difference!
    It i


  2. #2
    happycows
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    i would like to do a test for us chaps. chips with one robot like myself can we take a 24 hour reading on all electric used. can do it for a couple days if you have lots of welding to do! ours is just cows lights and milking/milk cooling. house is seperate.

  3. #3
    frigaste
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by happycows View Post
    i would like to do a test for us chaps. chips with one robot like myself can we take a 24 hour reading on all electric used. can do it for a couple days if you have lots of welding to do! ours is just cows lights and milking/milk cooling. house is seperate.
    Just worked out my electric for before robot. This includes house and everything. 107 units/day or 1.175 units/cow/day. 46.80/cow/year, 0.54p/litre

  4. #4
    chips
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by happycows View Post
    i would like to do a test for us chaps. chips with one robot like myself can we take a 24 hour reading on all electric used. can do it for a couple days if you have lots of welding to do! ours is just cows lights and milking/milk cooling. house is seperate.
    Bit tricky here as we have lecy scrappers, roller mill , and lecy storage heaters and all other house , and borehole pump all on one meter , plus a leaking air ram on sorting gate that I been waiting for a replacement on , lecy bill about 450/month though how much is the robot is anybodies guess
    Did used to be 450 a quarter though but we were then on 2p and 6p for night and day units , those were the days !!

  5. #5
    lazy farmer
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    for comparison with a block calver ours is 28.90 per cow or .44 of a penny. that includes 3 houses a briggs irriagtion system and a borehole. unit cost last year were 10.81 and 6.13

    lazy

  6. #6
    Yorkshire Farmer
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    As a point of further discussion a buying guide has been created in Holland to advise people on things to ask about and to promote and create discussion on what to look for. It is designed to make you question what you want out of buying a robot, and then get the right system to match what you need.
    I have attached it and would be interested if any of you feel any key points are not included as I have been asked to do something similar in the UK for people who are thinking about going robotic and to ensure they question what they are getting and that they get what they want.

  7. #7
    frigaste
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Cows out at day so started on building for robot

  8. #8
    mbsrhol
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Who sells most robot units in the Netherlands home of Lely?

    Answer: Fullwood

    No bull

  9. #9
    Yorkshire Farmer
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by mbsrhol View Post
    Who sells most robot units in the Netherlands home of Lely?

    Answer: Fullwood

    No bull
    thats interesting..! where did you hear that?

  10. #10
    mbsrhol
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    It was a Fullwood dealer, but he is an honest fellow. According to him Fullwood dealers in Holland have an umbrella organisation "moo" something or other. It all means back up support is well organised and this is recognised prospective purchasers.

  11. #11
    flumpy
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Good to see someone's giving Lely a run for there money, who was the Fullwood dealer ?

  12. #12
    Yorkshire Farmer
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    :lolk:

    he may be honest but someone is feeding him some Bull !

  13. #13
    Mayo
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    If you want to save juice/money, put up a small scale wind turbine.

  14. #14
    mbsrhol
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by flumpy View Post
    Good to see someone's giving Lely a run for there money, who was the Fullwood dealer ?
    Mewitec are the importer.

  15. #15
    mbsrhol
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by Yorkshire Farmer View Post
    :lolk:

    he may be honest but someone is feeding him some Bull !
    He also said Lely's aftercare deal was a tad on the dear side circa 6/7k you may be able to comfirm this?

    I have to qualify my contribution by adding this wasnt a sales pitch, he was maintaining my relatively new conventional set up.

  16. #16
    mawleymoos
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by Yorkshire Farmer View Post
    :lolk:

    he may be honest but someone is feeding him some Bull !
    I have also heard that there was more merlins sold in holland at the beginning of this year than lelys! but it will be intersting to see if it is only a blip! or if it continues! fullwood is quite involed in holland with quite a bit of manufacturing over there I beleive!

  17. #17
    Yorkshire Farmer
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    sales of merlin robots in holland are less than 10 per year and have been falling since some of their main parlour dealers refused to sell the robot.
    that is why they set up a central service company to just do the robot.

    bear in mind holland is not a big country distance wise we do the same area with 2 or 3 men and look after more robots.

    There are 4000 robots in holland (of all makes) I will let you guess who has the majority!

    (total care package is less than the 6k you have been told and basic service contract is much less)

  18. #18
    mbsrhol
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Ok I'm no expert, just wanted to put a couple posts in for YF's benefit, just in case the mods thought this thread should be moved into Classified section

  19. #19
    NeilO
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by mbsrhol View Post
    He also said Lely's aftercare deal was a tad on the dear side circa 6/7k you may be able to comfirm this?
    Depends on the level of service that you want and how much you are willing/capable of doing yourself. We pay about 2/3 of that for 2 robots.

  20. #20
    pendragon
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by Yorkshire Farmer View Post
    sales of merlin robots in holland are less than 10 per year and have been falling since some of their main parlour dealers refused to sell the robot.
    that is why they set up a central service company to just do the robot.

    bear in mind holland is not a big country distance wise we do the same area with 2 or 3 men and look after more robots.

    There are 4000 robots in holland (of all makes) I will let you guess who has the majority!

    (total care package is less than the 6k you have been told and basic service contract is much less)
    Tim, whoever is feeding you your information is also talking bull. Perhaps some of this bull has rubbed off on you a little too! Fullwood have sold 10 merlins to 4 farmers in one deal alone in Holland this year. Their market share has consistently grown over the last 4 years in the Netherlands.
    To be fair Lely in global terms had the highest market share for some time but the truth is that they are losing ground to the others who have upped their game. Lely were number 1 but are now number 2 and slipping in number of units sold wordlwide. Speak to Kees de Koening at Wageningen University in Holland if you have any doubts about the truth in that statement.
    Fact Mewitec is the support organisation for Fullwood Dealers in Netherlands. There are 10 Fullwood dealers in Netherlands all of whom sell merlin. www.fullwood.nl Have a look at the website. Quite different to the picture your are painting Tim! If you cant get your facts straight about Lely's home market, I wonder how much truth there is in some of your sales pitch?????????
    I think by your reaction you are feeling a little threatened by a company and a machine making more progress in the market place in the last 2 years than anyone would have given them credit for. If all you can do is knock the opposition, I think it highlights the weaknesses in your own arguments.

    And just to set the record straight on the Danish survey on robots, the Merlins in the report were Mk 1 merlins almost 7 years old. Fullwood have have had 3 major updates to Merlin since then. The new Merlin 225 is a much more efficient machine than the earlier machines. In fact an independant survey in the Netherlands recently showed the new Merlin 225 was almost identical to the A3 in power and water consumption but had more consistent and higher attachment speed than any of the robots currently on the market.

    Start of perparation to connected to all 4 teats: Merlin 54 seconds, A3 94 seconds. 40 seconds per milking difference. May not sound much but over 170 milkings per day gives an extra 1.8 hours available milking capacity in theory.

  21. #21
    chips
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by pendragon View Post

    Start of perparation to connected to all 4 teats: Merlin 54 seconds, A3 94 seconds. 40 seconds per milking difference. May not sound much but over 170 milkings per day gives an extra 1.8 hours available milking capacity in theory.
    Is that with equal brushing time ? otherwise it's just a setting and can bet set as low or high as you like , mine brushes all teats twice for 2 seconds to ensure good stimulation , I could lower this to 1 sec or 1 brush but lag time would increase and thus over all milk time would be no better but teat end damage would increase .

  22. #22
    mawleymoos
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by chips View Post
    Is that with equal brushing time ? otherwise it's just a setting and can bet set as low or high as you like , mine brushes all teats twice for 2 seconds to ensure good stimulation , I could lower this to 1 sec or 1 brush but lag time would increase and thus over all milk time would be no better but teat end damage would increase .
    does anybody else brush twice? I thought it was only for dirty cows! If it stimulates the cow it must be worth the extra time!

  23. #23
    chips
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by mawleymoos View Post
    does anybody else brush twice? I thought it was only for dirty cows! If it stimulates the cow it must be worth the extra time!
    Default setting for lely is to brush twice

  24. #24
    Kevin
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by chips View Post
    Default setting for lely is to brush twice
    It wouldn't matter how many times this 2nd hand Merlin brushed, it would be lucky to hit 2 teats at all!!

  25. #25
    chips
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
    It wouldn't matter how many times this 2nd hand Merlin brushed, it would be lucky to hit 2 teats at all!!
    Hope you get your problem sorted soon Kevin , It's funny with robots how you can have months of trouble free milking but a couple of days of a problem you can't solve makes you feel like it's not worth it .It's okay having problems when you know the cause even if it takes a couple of days to fix but it's the not knowing whether it'll get better that can be soul destroying .Thinking of starting the old parlour up is one thing until you actually remember how much work this would take, best stick to sloving the problems as they do get solved in the end . I think/hope we've solved our water valve failures that cost me so much hassle, but it took 12 mths to solve . Things going well here at the moment and the cheeky tanker driver said this morning it was the first time he'd seen anyone doing any work here for weeks and told me not to work too hard ! However I know I'm only one alarm away from disaster , you think you have everything sussed but with computers we know this is never the case . In fact I have a problem with the robot computer dropping it's broadband connection , this has been going on for 6 months and no one can solve it , Lely, BT, Dell , netgear or belkin have all tried and all failed and so I am at a loss as what to do , maybe try microsoft ? Not a huge problem but it does mean I can't remotely check on the cows unless some one keeps resetting the dns server .
    Has the older Merlin been updated to the later Merlins software as Pendragon who we presume is a fullwood dealer says that the old ones were poor in comparision to the later ones so I just wondered .
    Had a look at a cow in my A3 and it's brushing teats for over 60 seconds (default settings) and all attached by 84 secs so that's definitely where the difference in attachment times lies and the A3 could do it in 54 seconds or less even if you wanted to brush and stimulate less .

  26. #26
    pendragon
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by mbsrhol View Post
    Mewitec are the importer.
    Mewitec is a sales, marketing and technical support organisation which is jointly owned by the co-operative of all the Fullwood dealers in the Netherlands.

  27. #27
    chippy
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Fullwood say one thing and Lely say the complete opposite or Lely say something and Fullwood say the opposite..... just dont know who to believe now

  28. #28
    chips
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by chippy View Post
    Fullwood say one thing and Lely say the complete opposite or Lely say something and Fullwood say the opposite..... just dont know who to believe now
    And was ever thus with salesmen , go out and see farmers milking is the only way to decide , robot farmers are usually without exception more than happy to show people around

  29. #29
    upnorth
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Quote Originally Posted by pendragon View Post
    Start of perparation to connected to all 4 teats: Merlin 54 seconds, A3 94 seconds. 40 seconds per milking difference. May not sound much but over 170 milkings per day gives an extra 1.8 hours available milking capacity in theory.
    The brush time can be adjusted for the herd or an individual cow if necesary on an A3
    Never timed our A3s but a chap who was here last month who had spent a lot of time looking at all the robots on the market thought he had never seen one attach as quickly as ours.

    Those of you who are getting confused by the conflicting claims of the dealers should get in the car and talk to robot users on their farms, The vast majority are quite happy to tell you how it is, good and bad.

    Regarding service contracts mentioned earlier, we pay less than 4000/ year for 2 A3s

  30. #30
    upnorth
    Guest

    Re: Robot Milking - (All)

    Just watched a few cows through, 1min 30 -1min 45 from coming into the box to milk flowing.
    Av time in box 6min 45
    Av milkings / day drifts between 2.7 and 3

    The range is 1.5 to 4.5 visits /cow
    Yield / visit 10 - 12 litres

    We have same settings for all stages of lactation but the cows sort it out themselves so we find stale cows come 1.5 times and give 15 - 18.
    Fresh cows come 4.5 times and give 40 - 50.

    Touching wood very firmly we have not tubed a cow for mastitis since 20th Feb, and bactoscan & SCC are the lowest we have ever had. ( To keep within budget we did not put the steamers on)

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