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Thread: direct drilling rotation

  1. #31
    Steakeater
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by nick channer View Post
    we have winter wheat thats continous for 5 years, and have no plans on changing... doehill on here has wheat thats been in 7yrs [maybe more] with good results..
    What sort of yields? What sort of drill you using?

  2. #32
    Jim Bullock
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by nick channer View Post
    we have winter wheat thats continous for 5 years, and have no plans on changing... doehill on here has wheat thats been in 7yrs [maybe more] with good results..
    Continous Direct-Drilled wheat...?

  3. #33
    nick channer
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bullock View Post
    Continous Direct-Drilled wheat...?
    sorry. should have said.. not direct drilled.. ours is sumo'd then accord tine drill.. just bought a 4.8m claydon v drill so gonna put some rape and spring beans in with it. although agronomist said we come this far with continous wheat. should keep it the same with old system... he hasnt gotta buy the metal work and put the diesel in though!!

  4. #34
    Steakeater
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by nick channer View Post
    sorry. should have said.. not direct drilled.. ours is sumo'd then accord tine drill.. just bought a 4.8m claydon v drill so gonna put some rape and spring beans in with it. although agronomist said we come this far with continous wheat. should keep it the same with old system... he hasnt gotta buy the metal work and put the diesel in though!!
    Why not try continuous wheat with the claydon drill and then let us know how it goes?

  5. #35
    nick channer
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Steakeater View Post
    Why not try continuous wheat with the claydon drill and then let us know how it goes?
    we have no plans to change fom continous wheat using the claydon on 200 acres..

  6. #36
    Clive
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by nick channer View Post
    we have no plans to change fom continous wheat using the claydon on 200 acres..
    good luck ! continiuos wheat direct drilled is a recipe for certain disaster IMO

    you are very much at the mercy of chemistry doing its job well and resistance would scare the !@$% out of me !

  7. #37
    peasantman
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    WOSR, W Beans, Winter Wheat, then spring barley undersown with grass left for 4 years or whatever then back round to WOSR.

    DD the OSR (into sprayed off grass ley). Ploughing the beans in is a form of direct drilling and it breaks the slug problem following OSR. Then DD the WW after the beans to make use of the N and the low slug population left by the beans, then put in grass for our livestock or there could follow some spring cropping to pad out the rotation if you are all arable.

    I can't justify cover crops and the like due to cost and lost cropping opportunity.

    The above has worked well to keep blackgrass and slugs down and is fairly easy to do, but we don't stick to it, we vary according to weather and crop prices etc. Flexibility is key.

    But this year we might have to plough more to rectify compaction of silage work during weather and slug burden.

  8. #38
    Steakeater
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by peasantman View Post
    WOSR, W Beans, Winter Wheat, then spring barley undersown with grass left for 4 years or whatever then back round to WOSR.

    DD the OSR (into sprayed off grass ley). Ploughing the beans in is a form of direct drilling and it breaks the slug problem following OSR. Then DD the WW after the beans to make use of the N and the low slug population left by the beans, then put in grass for our livestock or there could follow some spring cropping to pad out the rotation if you are all arable.

    I can't justify cover crops and the like due to cost and lost cropping opportunity.

    The above has worked well to keep blackgrass and slugs down and is fairly easy to do, but we don't stick to it, we vary according to weather and crop prices etc. Flexibility is key.

    But this year we might have to plough more to rectify compaction of silage work during weather and slug burden.
    Ploughing is a form of direct drilling, well that is a new one for the books!

  9. #39
    james lloyd
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Fr View Post
    How do you get on with non irrigated maize. all my neighbours who grow maize irrigate.?
    I have no irrigation so have not tried maize. Sun flowers suffer if we get no rain for germination.
    May be we are a lot drier here than your area?
    non irrigated maize around here will yeild around 6-7ton/ha (the only summer rainfall is storms 20-30mm could fall in 1 storm ), we are predominately clay soils. Last year we had little rain (hot in may/june) cool july with some rain (not a whole pile) and we averaged 10/ha, but I think that was due tot the dry spring (roots went good and deep) and then cool period during flowering.

    Do pioneer push semexpert dry in you area?

    I went to a fredric thomas talk a few weeks back and he is very keen on maize as it return a lot of organic matter to the soil.

  10. #40
    Jim Bullock
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    James....
    Frederic and other pursuaded me to have a go at grain maize...and yes it has potential but ours only yielded just on 7 tons/ha (@14.5%MC), harvest was late so had to follow with another spring crop and in the UK marketing is a bit of a problem as there is an insufficient tonnage for most compounders...
    But it produced loads of residue, and helped no end with grassweed problems (although we had to spray for black grass despite the maize being drilled in early May...
    Oh nearly forgot...it had to go through the dryer 3 times..

  11. #41
    james lloyd
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bullock View Post
    James....
    Frederic and other pursuaded me to have a go at grain maize...and yes it has potential but ours only yielded just on 7 tons/ha (@14.5%MC), harvest was late so had to follow with another spring crop and in the UK marketing is a bit of a problem as there is an insufficient tonnage for most compounders...
    But it produced loads of residue, and helped no end with grassweed problems (although we had to spray for black grass despite the maize being drilled in early May...
    Oh nearly forgot...it had to go through the dryer 3 times..
    Jim
    What moisture did you harvest it at.

  12. #42
    Jim Bullock
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by james lloyd View Post
    Jim
    What moisture did you harvest it at.
    30-32% on December 10th.....finished drying it just in time for Christmas...I would grow it again if I could find a dairy farmer (rare species in worcestershire) who have it and crimp it...

  13. #43
    Mayo
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    If you can crimp it and find someone who wants it you will have the answer to your prayers.

  14. #44
    ranterrob
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bullock View Post
    James....
    Frederic and other pursuaded me to have a go at grain maize...and yes it has potential but ours only yielded just on 7 tons/ha (@14.5%MC), harvest was late so had to follow with another spring crop and in the UK marketing is a bit of a problem as there is an insufficient tonnage for most compounders...
    But it produced loads of residue, and helped no end with grassweed problems (although we had to spray for black grass despite the maize being drilled in early May...
    Oh nearly forgot...it had to go through the dryer 3 times..
    What crop did you follow it with, and how did you drill it and deal with any compaction from the combining ?

  15. #45
    Jim Bullock
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by ranterrob View Post
    What crop did you follow it with, and how did you drill it and deal with any compaction from the combining ?
    Spring rape after ploughing...total disaster...wet when ploughed in March then a drought until June...awful seedbed and a rape crop yielding circa 0.5 tons/acre....But we did have a superb spring rape crop that year which was direct-drilled (1.25 tons/acre)...just wish I had D-D'd the whole lot and not worried about the residue and the wheelings.

  16. #46
    james lloyd
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bullock View Post
    30-32% on December 10th.....finished drying it just in time for Christmas...I would grow it again if I could find a dairy farmer (rare species in worcestershire) who have it and crimp it...

    you can deal with the humidity, but harvesting in december is a problem. What variety did you grow and what indice was it. There are new genetics comming from america every year which are drilled after a crop of barley or wheat (ie mature in 90 days).

  17. #47
    FarmerDan
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by james lloyd View Post
    you can deal with the humidity, but harvesting in december is a problem. What variety did you grow and what indice was it. There are new genetics comming from america every year which are drilled after a crop of barley or wheat (ie mature in 90 days).
    Love this idea. Grow an early maturing winter barley, whole crop or combine it in mid-July (maybe not this year). Stick fast maturing maize in straight away. Harvest and crimp in October. Sow forage rye straight away. Graze off in spring. Sow fodder beet straight away. Harvest October.

    4 crops in 2 years.

    Would the 90 day maize grow in the UK though?

  18. #48
    Mayo
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by FarmerDan View Post
    Love this idea. Grow an early maturing winter barley, whole crop or combine it in mid-July (maybe not this year). Stick fast maturing maize in straight away. Harvest and crimp in October. Sow forage rye straight away. Graze off in spring. Sow fodder beet straight away. Harvest October.

    4 crops in 2 years.

    Would the 90 day maize grow in the UK though?
    Nice idea but we are going to be lucky to get one crop a year at the moment! :lolk:

    You guys need a bio-digester nearby for this maize. Tell them you want the substrate back, too.

    Just waiting to see in CPM Mr Bullock direct drilling it!

  19. #49
    Clive
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayo View Post
    Nice idea but we are going to be lucky to get one crop a year at the moment! :lolk:

    You guys need a bio-digester nearby for this maize. Tell them you want the substrate back, too.

    Just waiting to see in CPM Mr Bullock direct drilling it!
    i have land that neighbors the biggest AD plant in the UK

    trouble is they don't want to pay for stuff to put in it when they are getting paid to get rid of waste though it

    not sure it's working very well for them though from what I hear and the slurry like quality of the digestate that is coming out of it to be spread on our land

    looking forward to the day they decide they need to buy some maize !!

  20. #50
    Feldspar
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    What's the going rate for land let out for AD maize growing? We've been given a figure of 100/ac with the landowner keeping the SFP.

  21. #51
    FarmerDan
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Feldspar View Post
    What's the going rate for land let out for AD maize growing? We've been given a figure of 100/ac with the landowner keeping the SFP.
    Around here people tend to sell the standing crop. Used to be 400 to 450 per acre before the digesters. Now people are talking 550 per acre.

    That's besides the point though, they're immoral, and of naff all benefit to the environment unless they ARE using food waste etc.


  22. #52
    Feldspar
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by FarmerDan View Post
    Around here people tend to sell the standing crop. Used to be 400 to 450 per acre before the digesters. Now people are talking 550 per acre.

    That's besides the point though, they're immoral, and of naff all benefit to the environment unless they ARE using food waste etc.

    The only way I can see such a practice being justifiable from an ethical perspective is if you have livestock for which maize is grown, cease to keep said livestock and grow the maize for the AD plant instead (using the fact that growing meat rather than plant products for direct human consumption is also sub-optimal due to its relative inefficiency). AD plants are, in a way, more efficient cows.

    If the field would have otherwise grown milling wheat, for example, then yes I think -- when other forms of renewable energy, such as wind with its small ground footprint, are available -- it is not easily defended.

  23. #53
    shbangsteve
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bullock View Post
    30-32% on December 10th.....finished drying it just in time for Christmas...I would grow it again if I could find a dairy farmer (rare species in worcestershire) who have it and crimp it...
    Why don't you just crimp and clamp it yourself ,then sell it on during the winter. Once it has stalilised, after about 3 weeks, it can be sold and re-clamped. If you haven't got a clamp or a spare piece of concrete you could always ag-bag it. I grew some here in north Devon. Not intenionally, I sold my cows but could not sell my standing maize, so I combined it. The locals thought I was bonkers but it actually worked quite well. I crimped and bagged it at about 40% moisture and fed it to my beef cattle . Fanastic feed , better than wheat, although at higher cost on DM basis. The best thing though is what it does for the soil. Masses and masses of organic matter.

  24. #54
    Tim Fr
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by james lloyd View Post
    non irrigated maize around here will yeild around 6-7ton/ha (the only summer rainfall is storms 20-30mm could fall in 1 storm ), we are predominately clay soils. Last year we had little rain (hot in may/june) cool july with some rain (not a whole pile) and we averaged 10/ha, but I think that was due tot the dry spring (roots went good and deep) and then cool period during flowering.

    Do pioneer push semexpert dry in you area?

    I went to a fredric thomas talk a few weeks back and he is very keen on maize as it return a lot of organic matter to the soil.
    I will talk to my coop about semexpert.
    We have Fredric Thomas coming to our area at the end of September, very much looking forward to hearing him speak.

  25. #55
    BSH
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Been thinking about rotations (again!) and wondered what the forums thoughts were on the following: WW/Cover crop-Spring Barley/Mustard catch crop-W Oats/Cover crop Spring Beans.

    I am trying to think of a rotation that will allow me to sow a cover crop every other year so that on a system where I grow two crops on the farm at any one time I can have half the farm in covercrop over winter for outwintering stock.

  26. #56
    clover
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by BSH View Post
    Been thinking about rotations (again!) and wondered what the forums thoughts were on the following: WW/Cover crop-Spring Barley/Mustard catch crop-W Oats/Cover crop Spring Beans.

    I am trying to think of a rotation that will allow me to sow a cover crop every other year so that on a system where I grow two crops on the farm at any one time I can have half the farm in covercrop over winter for outwintering stock.
    How about spring barley sown out with IRG followed by late Sept sown WB followed by stubble turnips.Stock should get six weeks or more on the IRG,then move to the stubble turnips.The spring barley could be replaced with spring oats from time to time,for a bit of diversity.If chopping straw,your crops will be growing in compost!

  27. #57
    BSH
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Thank you, that is something to consider.

  28. #58
    Normandyfarmer
    Guest

    Re: direct drilling rotation

    Quote Originally Posted by FarmerDan View Post
    Love this idea. Grow an early maturing winter barley, whole crop or combine it in mid-July (maybe not this year). Stick fast maturing maize in straight away. Harvest and crimp in October. Sow forage rye straight away. Graze off in spring. Sow fodder beet straight away. Harvest October.

    4 crops in 2 years.

    Would the 90 day maize grow in the UK though?
    Mid July would still be too late to plant it. I would not plant corn after the 5th of July really. If you have an early frost you have nothing left.

    Careful 90 days does not mean that you can go in the field 90 days after drilling.

    @ Jim : Wich index was it ? 250-220 ?
    The good thing with grain maize is that you can cover the seeds of your crop of cover crop with a pass of shredder or superficial pass of power harrow.

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