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Thread: Micronic centrifugal filters

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    Micronic centrifugal filters

    I'm curious about the micronic filter fitted to my recently acquired MF4225.

    As I understand it, the filter should be cleaned every 1000 hours.

    Is that all there is to it? Is it a better filter than the usual paper elements i.e. can it remove smaller particles than the paper?

    I presume a new seal needs to be fitted at each cleaning.

    The MF4225 appears to have an additional paper element filter adjacent to the external dual pumps. If the micronic filter is better than paper, why the paper element?

    Or am I missing something?

    JV
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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by john maddock View Post
    I'm curious about the micronic filter fitted to my recently acquired MF4225.

    As I understand it, the filter should be cleaned every 1000 hours.

    Is that all there is to it? Is it a better filter than the usual paper elements i.e. can it remove smaller particles than the paper?

    I presume a new seal needs to be fitted at each cleaning.

    The MF4225 appears to have an additional paper element filter adjacent to the external dual pumps. If the micronic filter is better than paper, why the paper element?

    Or am I missing something?

    JV
    I think your MF Squealer will definetly suggest replacement, rather than cleaning.
    Had it's purpose explained a long while ago....must have gone into the grey matter department labelled "not likely to be immediately required"

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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    I think your MF Squealer will definetly suggest replacement, rather than cleaning.
    Had it's purpose explained a long while ago....must have gone into the grey matter department labelled "not likely to be immediately required"
    Oops! Sorry, should have explained, the filter I'm interested in is on the transmission.

    JV
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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by john maddock View Post
    Oops! Sorry, should have explained, the filter I'm interested in is on the transmission.

    JV




    Hello John,

    Had a look and can now see what you are on about! Its the can with the lines/grooves in its top? Only seen these on TD5 landrover engines where they fit one of those and a spin on cannister filter. Also came across a similar principle on a late 70's Scania 110 truck - it had a cannister you could remove and dig out the rubbery sort of sludge that a spinning rotor sprayed up the sides of the can.

    I Think you will find that the item above will have two bronze bushes for it to spin on and a pair of small jet holes underneath to make it spin round thereby spinning the sludge and bits to the outside of the can. On the TD5's you simply removed the two bolt lid, fished the filter out and slipped a new one over the shaft & refit the lid. On the one above it looks similar but not sure about the seal and saucer shaped thing below. need someone who has actually fiddled with one of these really
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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by Footsfitter View Post




    Hello John,

    Had a look and can now see what you are on about! Its the can with the lines/grooves in its top? Only seen these on TD5 landrover engines where they fit one of those and a spin on cannister filter. Also came across a similar principle on a late 70's Scania 110 truck - it had a cannister you could remove and dig out the rubbery sort of sludge that a spinning rotor sprayed up the sides of the can.

    I Think you will find that the item above will have two bronze bushes for it to spin on and a pair of small jet holes underneath to make it spin round thereby spinning the sludge and bits to the outside of the can. On the TD5's you simply removed the two bolt lid, fished the filter out and slipped a new one over the shaft & refit the lid. On the one above it looks similar but not sure about the seal and saucer shaped thing below. need someone who has actually fiddled with one of these really
    Thanks Ff

    Very interesting!

    The parts diagram I have (p.# 3-XP31-018-A ) is different. Same model tractors, same serial numbers, but no can with grooves on top as your diagram shows. Numbers are different too.

    The only clue to what it does has come from this:

    https://www.used-massey-tractors.com...me/brochure-38

    p.24.

    Certainly shows more than just the cover in the diagram I have.

    More sleuthing required, I think.

    JV
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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by john maddock View Post
    Thanks Ff

    Very interesting!

    The parts diagram I have (p.# 3-XP31-018-A ) is different. Same model tractors, same serial numbers, but no can with grooves on top as your diagram shows. Numbers are different too.

    The only clue to what it does has come from this:

    https://www.used-massey-tractors.com...me/brochure-38

    p.24.

    Certainly shows more than just the cover in the diagram I have.

    More sleuthing required, I think.

    JV
    Looking at that brochure, I can just make out the lines of the cannisters grooves in the cutaway picture, but interestingly I reckon that the saucer thing may be there to collect the muck? they say its cleanable so I wonder if you unbolt the spindle, clean it out and refit? The Landrover one was 100% bin it and fit a new one- maybe they developed a serviceable version for tight wads in far flung corners of the globe (may include Northumbria of course)
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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by Footsfitter View Post
    Looking at that brochure, I can just make out the lines of the cannisters grooves in the cutaway picture, but interestingly I reckon that the saucer thing may be there to collect the muck? they say its cleanable so I wonder if you unbolt the spindle, clean it out and refit? The Landrover one was 100% bin it and fit a new one- maybe they developed a serviceable version for tight wads in far flung corners of the globe (may include Northumbria of course)
    Northumbria would definitely be in the picture !

    Further info now to hand: Agco part # is 3800350M91, comes only as a complete unit, so it's now on order. Google shows a better drawing of it, using that part number.

    JV
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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by Footsfitter View Post
    Looking at that brochure, I can just make out the lines of the cannisters grooves in the cutaway picture, but interestingly I reckon that the saucer thing may be there to collect the muck? they say its cleanable so I wonder if you unbolt the spindle, clean it out and refit? The Landrover one was 100% bin it and fit a new one- maybe they developed a serviceable version for tight wads in far flung corners of the globe (may include Northumbria of course)

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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Did Zetor's of a certain era not use this idea for the engine oil filter?

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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    If you dismantle the centrifugal filter you may find there is nothing inside it. On later tractors (maybe only ones with powershuttle) it was found (I think) that these filters cause the oil to overheat. The MF modification was to remove it's internals and plumb in a ordinary pencil style replaceable element filter. Part of the mod was also a different oil cooler. I have a 43 series tractor and this mod was carried out on it, leaving the housing of the centrifuge there but nothing inside.

    If it is still all there then it just needs cleaning.

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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by Smiley View Post
    If you dismantle the centrifugal filter you may find there is nothing inside it. On later tractors (maybe only ones with powershuttle) it was found (I think) that these filters cause the oil to overheat. The MF modification was to remove it's internals and plumb in a ordinary pencil style replaceable element filter. Part of the mod was also a different oil cooler. I have a 43 series tractor and this mod was carried out on it, leaving the housing of the centrifuge there but nothing inside.

    If it is still all there then it just needs cleaning.
    Thanks Smiley, for a very interesting post, adding to our knowledge.

    My tractor has the manual shuttle and no oil cooler. Since I've had it (2 months) it's been used for more than a few minutes on only two occasions. On both, when the engine was stopped, there was a quiet whirring sound, rather like the last 5 seconds of an air raid siren spinning down. Maybe that was the centrifugal filter coming to a halt, and maybe it is so full of gunk that the oil has to be hot for it to work.

    I haven't been brave enough to remove & examine it, coz Murphy's Law #36 says that the seal will be brittle & leak.
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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Indeed Zetor did use this type of filter very effectively.

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    Re: Micronic centrifugal filters

    Quote Originally Posted by john maddock View Post
    Thanks Smiley, for a very interesting post, adding to our knowledge.

    My tractor has the manual shuttle and no oil cooler. Since I've had it (2 months) it's been used for more than a few minutes on only two occasions. On both, when the engine was stopped, there was a quiet whirring sound, rather like the last 5 seconds of an air raid siren spinning down. Maybe that was the centrifugal filter coming to a halt, and maybe it is so full of gunk that the oil has to be hot for it to work.

    I haven't been brave enough to remove & examine it, coz Murphy's Law #36 says that the seal will be brittle & leak.
    Despite my concern about Murphy's Law #36, I had a rush of blood to the head and tackled The Monster.

    Worst part was getting at it to clean the dirt from around the beast. It's in a mongrel of a place: ahead of the back axle. under the linkage controls & behind a couple of cables, where even the pressure washer could not get. Eventually managed to scrape enough dirt off the surrounds with a modified piece of wire to satisfy myself it was clean & took the cover off with no trouble.

    Inside, it looked like a simplified cream separator (why would it look different? ). A knurled nut holds the dome on the spindle, which runs on a pair of brass bushes as described by Ff above. A pair of tangential jets in the base cause it to spin.

    There was about a 2mm thick layer of dry "dirt" packed on the inside the fluted dome. See my pics below ( I hope). After scraping out the dome I washed it in petrol, and noted a sheen on the surface, suggesting *very* fine metal particles - micron sized?

    The whirring sound at engine shutdown is definitely the filter, but why it can be heard only after the tractor has worked for a while is beyond me at the moment.

    JV
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