Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 60 of 136

Thread: Brexit, yes or no?

  1. #31
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    I know I have mentioned this before but probably timely now to repeat myself in this discussion (it's not an argument please, it's a discussion or a debate) To a large extent I think the whole Brexit issue is an age thing. Jack and I remember when the U.K. was called Great Britain. That was probably a bit pompous but we did have the last vestiges of an Empire. The latter morphed into a Commonwealth, Great Britain became the United Kingdom although even that is starting to disintegrate now.

    Jack and I thought that the Common Market was basically a good idea. If nothing else the basics meant that there was a fair chance of stopping another European war, maybe even another World war. And for a few years it was good. But it has grown like Topsy. And, in truth, the whole monolith has taken over large swathes of our lives. A lot of the Governance of the EU is unelected and people like Jack and I see people whoi have jumped on the gravy train which some people are wont to do if they find an easy passage through life. In my opinion we have plenty of our own MPs who couldn't run the proverbial in a brewery. In my view the U.K. is U.K. plc. It should be administered by people with business brains, acumen, and experience. Read what James Dyson says about Brexit. And I vehemently support that we must always provide an education and health system that is free at the point of delivery and a welfare system for those who need a bit of help.

    But we have lost control of our borders and to a degree our judicial system, not to mention our governence. That for me is enough to want to be freed from the clutches of the EU.

    What is really worrying is that we have become a very divided society. The haves & the have nots. There are those in inner city areas who have basically nothing, and yet look at house prices. Somebody is paying them or they wouldn't be the level they are. It's what is going to happen in this country in the future that we really need to be worried about and we need to have the ability to correct the imbalance without any interference from any Heinrich, Pascal, or Antoinette.
    Thank you, constructive debate!
    We can all learn from debate.
    You are correct, we have lost control of our borders, our judicial system and our governance.
    The blackmail by EU politicians/administrators, re single market and free movement is just that blackmail.
    The instinctive vote of our people in the referendum was due in my opinion not to prejudice but to sheer practicality. The population of our country has risen from the early 50 millions to something more than 67 million. This has put huge pressure on our infrastructure and services. No one has looked at the tragedy of the Grenfell Towers fire objectively and wondered at the need for high rise housing, especially in a metropolitan city with high cost housing. How on earth those people expect to get rehoused in a fortnight I will never know. In any case it is rumoured that some were illegal immigrants anyway. I am not being racist, just realistic.
    I do not believe we will lose jobs in this country as a result of brexit, we have been very fortunate to avoid the Euro, otherwise we would probably have finished up like Italy, Greece and Spain.
    What we need now is positive government, a clean break brexit and everything will sort itself out.
    The only people to suffer will be the fat cats in Belgium, who I shall be in close proximity with tomorrow as I am going on the overnight ferry tonight to Bruge for one glass of Belgian beer!
    Jack Caley

  2. #32
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    NB Canada
    Posts
    496

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    . . . one glass of Belgian beer!
    Jack Caley
    Must be really really good beer if all you need is one

  3. #33
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ironhead View Post
    Must be really really good beer if all you need is one
    Just back from that trip.
    Very short trip but very enjoyable. Took my young granddaughters, so that they could enjoy the ferry trip and Brugge, a beautiful place.
    One very big impression though, with the devalued pound, things are tremendously expensive.
    A very small bag of chips with ketchup for my granddaughters, 3.20 euros!
    It all really does confirm my views that the europeans are really shooting themselves in the foot. The more uncertainty they create , the worse they make it for themselves. BMW and Mercedes are really going to either lose a lot of British Market or else reduce their prices artificially. Either way they lose out, we can always buy Lexus, Toyota , Nissan or Range rovers.
    The big advantage we do have is not being tied in to the euro, not like Italy, Greece or Spain, especially Italy who Europe has ruined.
    I see the Chancelloer has said that any minister can be sacked, he needs to be brought in to the real world, that even Boris knows a little bit more about.
    Jack Caley.

  4. #34
    Senior Member skoda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ruthin ,Denbighshire,N Wales
    Posts
    1,064

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    https://www.farminguk.com/news/Briti...tes_47545.html Some brilliant ideas coming to the fore .
    Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, but expecting different results.

  5. #35
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by skoda View Post
    https://www.farminguk.com/news/Briti...tes_47545.html Some brilliant ideas coming to the fore .
    To be fair, Cranswick Abattoir near here have been exporting various parts of the pig to the Far East extensively the last few years.
    Just goes to show we do not need all these so-called trade agreements anyway. If the product is good and the price is right we can sell it. We do not need Davis or EU or anybody, and WTO tariffs are not insurmountable anyway.
    Jack Caley

  6. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    NB Canada
    Posts
    496

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    To be fair, Cranswick Abattoir near here have been exporting various parts of the pig to the Far East extensively the last few years.
    Just goes to show we do not need all these so-called trade agreements anyway. If the product is good and the price is right we can sell it. We do not need Davis or EU or anybody, and WTO tariffs are not insurmountable anyway.
    Jack Caley
    Didn't I see something the other day where Turkey doesn't think it needs the EU anymore? an upcoming Tuexit?

  7. #37
    Senior Member skoda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ruthin ,Denbighshire,N Wales
    Posts
    1,064

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ironhead View Post
    Didn't I see something the other day where Turkey doesn't think it needs the EU anymore? an upcoming Tuexit?
    An immaculate conception as they have never entered.
    Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, but expecting different results.

  8. #38
    Senior Member skoda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ruthin ,Denbighshire,N Wales
    Posts
    1,064

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    To be fair, Cranswick Abattoir near here have been exporting various parts of the pig to the Far East extensively the last few years.
    Just goes to show we do not need all these so-called trade agreements anyway. If the product is good and the price is right we can sell it. We do not need Davis or EU or anybody, and WTO tariffs are not insurmountable anyway.
    Jack Caley
    We could start exporting more Lamb and all kinds of food to China if we dropped our prices ,or if their currency was to dramatically strengthen.
    Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, but expecting different results.

  9. #39
    Senior Member grassmanman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Northern Ireland
    Posts
    888

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    To be fair, Cranswick Abattoir near here have been exporting various parts of the pig to the Far East extensively the last few years.
    Just goes to show we do not need all these so-called trade agreements anyway. If the product is good and the price is right we can sell it. We do not need Davis or EU or anybody, and WTO tariffs are not insurmountable anyway.
    Jack Caley
    Not sure of the specifics but the product is most likely 5th quarter stuff which we wouldn't eat and at a price we wouldn't like to be taking for the rest of the carcase.

  10. #40
    Senior Member LALANS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Scotland, land of the free home of the brave
    Posts
    391

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    The only issue at stake here in terms of reaching an agreement is money. Without the UK's contribution the EU budget will have a black hole of 15 billion euros. In addition the extra 15 billion euro expenditure on additional vanity projects will have a serious shortfall without the UK pitching in. As a result the net contributor countries will have to dig deeper and those which gain more i.e. France will have to receive less.
    The ball is at the UK's feet but we seem unable to grasp this fact.
    If no agreement is reached we revert to World Trade Tariffs which ave 3%, actually less than EU rates.
    Please also remember that the EU commission runs the show and is a completely unelected and generally unanswerable cabal of has been and failed euro politicians who are playing 'Billy Big Balls'
    Although UK agriculture would see price drops (which would be countered by a fall in the pound) many of our inputs would become far cheaper, fert, agro chems etc.
    The EU is very much a protection racket in terms of trade and is very much on a shaky nail.
    It is people who trade not governments or politicians a salient fact worth remembering.

  11. #41
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by LALANS View Post
    The only issue at stake here in terms of reaching an agreement is money. Without the UK's contribution the EU budget will have a black hole of 15 billion euros. In addition the extra 15 billion euro expenditure on additional vanity projects will have a serious shortfall without the UK pitching in. As a result the net contributor countries will have to dig deeper and those which gain more i.e. France will have to receive less.
    The ball is at the UK's feet but we seem unable to grasp this fact.
    If no agreement is reached we revert to World Trade Tariffs which ave 3%, actually less than EU rates.
    Please also remember that the EU commission runs the show and is a completely unelected and generally unanswerable cabal of has been and failed euro politicians who are playing 'Billy Big Balls'
    Although UK agriculture would see price drops (which would be countered by a fall in the pound) many of our inputs would become far cheaper, fert, agro chems etc.
    The EU is very much a protection racket in terms of trade and is very much on a shaky nail.
    It is people who trade not governments or politicians a salient fact worth remembering.
    Very well put,
    Jack Caley

  12. #42
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by grassmanman View Post
    Not sure of the specifics but the product is most likely 5th quarter stuff which we wouldn't eat and at a price we wouldn't like to be taking for the rest of the carcase.
    You are correct, but that is what Gove was talking about, pigs ears!
    Jack Caley

  13. #43
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Northumbrialand
    Posts
    1,255

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    If "Speccy Gove" opened a door for me and said after you, I would be having a dam good look to make sure it was actually a door!

  14. #44
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    The whole scenario seems to get worse every day!
    At one time I did believe Teresa May, that Brexit meant Brexit. Now, with Hammond and the Home Secretary exerting undue influence, I am beginning to wonder if we will ever leave.
    One heartening thought though on Facebook there were hundreds who said that after the EU. Behaviour lately they were more than ever convinced to leave!
    Jack Caley.
    Its just about money!!

  15. #45
    Senior Member skoda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ruthin ,Denbighshire,N Wales
    Posts
    1,064

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    The whole scenario seems to get worse every day!
    At one time I did believe Teresa May, that Brexit meant Brexit. Now, with Hammond and the Home Secretary exerting undue influence, I am beginning to wonder if we will ever leave.
    One heartening thought though on Facebook there were hundreds who said that after the EU. Behaviour lately they were more than ever convinced to leave!
    Jack Caley.
    Its just about money!!
    No shortage of echo chambers on FB to seek reassurance .
    Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, but expecting different results.

  16. #46
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by skoda View Post
    No shortage of echo chambers on FB to seek reassurance .
    I would agree with you if it were not for the total apathy of the masses. Normally most people are so apathetic they just read and carry on. They have got to feel strongly just to write a few words.
    There were some remainders who wrote that after they had realised that Europe just wants our money, they had changed their minds.
    Jack Caley

  17. #47
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Northumbrialand
    Posts
    1,255

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    I would agree with you if it were not for the total apathy of the masses. Normally most people are so apathetic they just read and carry on. They have got to feel strongly just to write a few words.
    There were some remainders who wrote that after they had realised that Europe just wants our money, they had changed their minds.
    Jack Caley
    Yessssss....the Tory Remainer upper echelons appear to be very much in the mood for realising that they were at the time misguided.
    Now that this error has been pointed out to them, they feel the need to make this clear to the media!

  18. #48
    Senior Member Footsfitter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Basingstoke, Hants
    Posts
    2,416

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    The whole scenario seems to get worse every day!
    At one time I did believe Teresa May, that Brexit meant Brexit. Now, with Hammond and the Home Secretary exerting undue influence, I am beginning to wonder if we will ever leave.
    One heartening thought though on Facebook there were hundreds who said that after the EU. Behaviour lately they were more than ever convinced to leave!
    Jack Caley.
    Its just about money!!
    One of advantage down here in Oz Jack is that Brexit is very much off the radar, theres plenty here to be chewing over their politicians with feet in more than one country, Clive Palmer who still hasn't extricated himself from loosing most of his farm and mineral rights since we were last here 18months ago and of course now its the weekend the whole country has time out for sport of some sort....................!
    The best thing about Facebook is the logout button......

  19. #49
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Northumbrialand
    Posts
    1,255

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Footsfitter View Post
    One of advantage down here in Oz Jack is that Brexit is very much off the radar, theres plenty here to be chewing over their politicians with feet in more than one country, Clive Palmer who still hasn't extricated himself from loosing most of his farm and mineral rights since we were last here 18months ago and of course now its the weekend the whole country has time out for sport of some sort....................!
    Try and leave things tidy when you leave!
    Following you around.

  20. #50
    Senior Member Footsfitter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Basingstoke, Hants
    Posts
    2,416

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    Try and leave things tidy when you leave!
    Following you around.
    Sadly the Brand Highway up north does have a fair bit of litter scattered around, luckily no where near as much as we saw the 1st time here going up the bottom end of the same No1 highway from Esperance to the goldfields. It seems that drivers are unable to keep all their litter with them and it becomes more apparent the more remote the area is- either its boredom or less police to catch the litter bugs.


    I hope my promoter covered his margin and my fee then
    The best thing about Facebook is the logout button......

  21. #51
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,456

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    If "Speccy Gove" opened a door for me and said after you, I would be having a dam good look to make sure it was actually a door!
    This is pretty much the crux of the matter for me. Even if leaving was a good idea, you've still got to trust our current crop of politicians to deliver it.

    This is an example of the sort of idiocy we're dealing with here:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ld-boost-food/

    I mean where do you even begin with the stupidity of that statement?

    I wouldn't trust them to find their arses with both hands, let alone negotiate a complex and unprecedented international trade deal with multiple partners. Even those who think Brexit is a great idea even now must have reservations about the team of imbeciles charged with actually making it happen.

  22. #52
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    NB Canada
    Posts
    496

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    This is pretty much the crux of the matter for me. Even if leaving was a good idea, you've still got to trust our current crop of politicians to deliver it.

    This is an example of the sort of idiocy we're dealing with here:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ld-boost-food/

    I mean where do you even begin with the stupidity of that statement?

    I wouldn't trust them to find their arses with both hands, let alone negotiate a complex and unprecedented international trade deal with multiple partners. Even those who think Brexit is a great idea even now must have reservations about the team of imbeciles charged with actually making it happen.
    I took a quick look at the article and I think Britain could be self-sufficient in food production - there just wouldn't be the variety of foods available that exist with global trade.

    "unprecedented international trade deal with multiple partners" - there are multiple mult-partner trade deals in other parts of the world - the Canadian EU deal, NAFTA (Canada, US, Mexico), Pan-American trade deal (many parts of North and South America), Pan-Pacific (I think that is what it is called) for many countries bordering the Pacific ocean, etc.

    Britain's biggest problem is it has depended on the EU for the last few decades and has lost "the touch" in negotiating for its own benefit. Perhaps they need to bring in some of the negotiators from these other trade deals to act on Britain's behalf?

  23. #53
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    This is pretty much the crux of the matter for me. Even if leaving was a good idea, you've still got to trust our current crop of politicians to deliver it.

    This is an example of the sort of idiocy we're dealing with here:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ld-boost-food/

    I mean where do you even begin with the stupidity of that statement?

    I wouldn't trust them to find their arses with both hands, let alone negotiate a complex and unprecedented international trade deal with multiple partners. Even those who think Brexit is a great idea even now must have reservations about the team of imbeciles charged with actually making it happen.
    The main reason we were even allowed in to 00,00the Common Market, was precisely because the Europeans wanted our market. Do not forget De Gaulle would not allow us in for a start!
    Take for instance the pig industry, we had a herd of 800,000 sows at one time in the UK. It is now about 400,000! By various means including cheap imported feed from Indonesia, poor welfare standards, sow stalls etc, and our processors prepared to screw British producers, the number of pig producers just down this coastline fell by 30odd within 20 miles of here..
    They wanted our market then, they still want it.
    What politicians ought to do is just pull straight out of the single market , and the customs union and let them come begging to us.
    For years I went across borders in Europe with no hassle. It was easy just to put customs documents in the ships box, to be put over the side whilst we were in the lock in Hull port. There is absolutely no reason why we should not still have a free market, only EU politicians holding a gun at our heads, so they can carry on drawing billions from us to support their federalist dreams and incomes.
    Those billions would pay something towards our NHS and help to house the millions of immigrants.
    Jack Caley

  24. #54
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,456

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    only EU politicians holding a gun at our heads,
    It's not the EU politicians holding the gun, we're holding it ourselves, i suppose we could always not pull the trigger but, you know, taking back control and all that.

  25. #55
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,328

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    One problem that we have which rarely gets a mention is that a lot of the cabinet voted remain. How on Earth can they have their hearts in the job of brexit ? We have a Prime Minister and a Chancellor who never wanted to leave in the first place. And Hammond's buddy Osborne is going to do his level best to screw things up if he can by trying to persuade Hammond what a bad idea it was.
    Last edited by zaza; 17-10-17 at 03:31 PM.

  26. #56
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,456

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    One problem that we have which rrarely gets a mention is that a lot of the cabinet voted remain. How on Earth can they have their hearts in the job of brexit ? We have a Prime Minister and a Chancellor who never wanted to leave in the first place. And Hammond's buddy Osborne is going to do his level best to screw things up if he can by trying to persuade Hammond what a bad idea it was.
    To be fair, that's because it is a bad idea.

    It creates uncertainty and disruption and it's a wholly unnecessary risk that could have been avoided and th best case scenario at the end of it is not some magical land of economic milk and honey but a chance that we manage to remain something like as prosperous as we are now, and the prize for wading through all this shit is some ideological notion of sovereignty which will ultimately mean nothing to the average voter's day to day life.

    even if you think this intangible future pay off is worth all the uncertainty in the meantime, just pause for a second and take a look at the incompetents and idiots who we have to steer us through this mess, and then tell me you're confident it will all be sorted to our advantage.

    One problem that we have which rrarely gets a mention is that a lot of the cabinet voted remain
    The reason we had this referendum was to try and quash once and for all the tory party's division over europe, instead rather than uniting the tory party it reveals a similar split in the UK's population, way to go there Dave.

    We're left with a weak govt acting in their party and personal interests rather than the country's, led by a prime minister who has no authority but is still in the job because if someone mounted a successful leadership challenge they'd have to call an election which they would almost certainly lose. anyway, which of the crop of nonentities and oddballs would you want running the country in her place? Rees-Mogg? Boris? Gove?

  27. #57
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    To be fair, that's because it is a bad idea.

    It creates uncertainty and disruption and it's a wholly unnecessary risk that could have been avoided and th best case scenario at the end of it is not some magical land of economic milk and honey but a chance that we manage to remain something like as prosperous as we are now, and the prize for wading through all this shit is some ideological notion of sovereignty which will ultimately mean nothing to the average voter's day to day life.

    even if you think this intangible future pay off is worth all the uncertainty in the meantime, just pause for a second and take a look at the incompetents and idiots who we have to steer us through this mess, and then tell me you're confident it will all be sorted to our advantage.



    The reason we had this referendum was to try and quash once and for all the tory party's division over europe, instead rather than uniting the tory party it reveals a similar split in the UK's population, way to go there Dave.

    We're left with a weak govt acting in their party and personal interests rather than the country's, led by a prime minister who has no authority but is still in the job because if someone mounted a successful leadership challenge they'd have to call an election which they would almost certainly lose. anyway, which of the crop of nonentities and oddballs would you want running the country in her place? Rees-Mogg? Boris? Gove?
    I do not believe that thhe referendum was about sovereignty. It was principally about immigration and benefits.A public feeling not just by the Conservative party, there were a lot of Labour leave voters too. It is a common feeling throughout Europe, for example Austria last weekend, Merkel very substantial loss of votes, Le Penn in France, support in the Netherlands.
    The population of this country has gone up 15 million in 50 years, putting intolerable pressure on infrastructure and services. Grenfell towers was a tragedy, but it was a symptom of the need to house population as cheaply as possible.
    Rather than the UK paying 350 million a week to Europe, it ought to have been in reverse so we could expand our NHS, education and social housing to cope. I am not been racist, just pragmatic.
    This morning on the Today programme the German spokesman finally admitted they needed the money to pay EU pensions. Pensions for civil servants whose only purpose was to serve another level of government , totally unnecessary, as we already used to have a government of our own.
    I agree about the uncertainty, but one of the main reasons is that we finished up with a emailer as PM, surrounded by remainders.
    What we needed was someone with balls to call the bluff of EU politicians whose only need is money, not some European dream, that has long since become unnecessary. What we need is a complete hard brexit, and let Europe come begging to us to supply us with pigmeat, cheese, wine and brandy!
    I also agree about the uncertainty, but do not forget that uncertainty is devaluing the pound, which means that the Germans for instance are shooting themselves in the foot, we shall have to run around in Nissans and Range Rovers instead of Mercedes and BMW,s!
    Jack Caley

  28. #58
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,328

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    We're left with a weak govt acting in their party and personal interests rather than the country's, led by a prime minister who has no authority but is still in the job because if someone mounted a successful leadership challenge they'd have to call an election which they would almost certainly lose. anyway, which of the crop of nonentities and oddballs would you want running the country in her place? Rees-Mogg? Boris? Gove?
    And what's the alternative ? Corbyn and his Marxist hangers-on ? Good luck with that one chap.

    So you want to stay in the EU and pay for all the waste, including the salaries and pensions that are entirely unnecessary ? Do you really think that Kinnock & Co are worthy of such largesse ? And Jack says, correctly, that the leave vote was, to a large extent (but far from entirely) the result of uncontrolled immigration. Yes, and what about the generally agreed figure of a further 650,000 that are illegal (Office of National Statistics) which are under the radar ? And the figure for their children is generally reckoned to push that up to 1 million.

    And you don't want control of our borders ? That's a Lib-Dem doctrine if ever I heard it.
    Last edited by zaza; 17-10-17 at 06:22 PM.

  29. #59
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Holderness
    Posts
    658

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    And what's the alternative ? Corbyn and his Marxist hangers-on ? Good luck with that one chap.

    So you want to stay in the EU and pay for all the waste, including the salaries and pensions that are entirely unnecessary ? Do you really think that Kinnock & Co are worthy of such largesse ? And Jack says, correctly, that the leave vote was, to a large extent (but far from entirely) the result of uncontrolled immigration. Yes, and what about the generally agreed figure of a further 650,000 that are illegal (Office of National Statistics) which are under the radar ? And the figure for their children is generally reckoned to push that up to 1 million.

    And you don't want control of our borders ? That's a Lib-Dem doctrine if ever I heard it.
    WELL SAID,
    The trouble is the whole game has changed because Europe is trying to blackmail us with the single market/economy thing.
    I honestly do not believe we would lose the jobs they say we will.
    I think if Europes bluff was called, the whole free trade would carry on as before.
    we would be able to go back to how it was 30 years ago when I started trading with Italy.
    Europe has too much to lose in losing our market.
    I am surprised Boris has meekly gone towards supposedly supporting Teresa. I suppose if he got the sack he would have no power in cabinet , to influence things. Especially if Jeremy was in the chair!
    Jack Caley

  30. #60
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    North East Coast
    Posts
    193

    Re: Brexit, yes or no?

    Quote Originally Posted by matbrojoe View Post
    To be fair, that's because it is a bad idea.

    It creates uncertainty and disruption and it's a wholly unnecessary risk that could have been avoided and th best case scenario at the end of it is not some magical land of economic milk and honey but a chance that we manage to remain something like as prosperous as we are now, and the prize for wading through all this shit is some ideological notion of sovereignty which will ultimately mean nothing to the average voter's day to day life.

    even if you think this intangible future pay off is worth all the uncertainty in the meantime, just pause for a second and take a look at the incompetents and idiots who we have to steer us through this mess, and then tell me you're confident it will all be sorted to our advantage.



    The reason we had this referendum was to try and quash once and for all the tory party's division over europe, instead rather than uniting the tory party it reveals a similar split in the UK's population, way to go there Dave.

    We're left with a weak govt acting in their party and personal interests rather than the country's, led by a prime minister who has no authority but is still in the job because if someone mounted a successful leadership challenge they'd have to call an election which they would almost certainly lose. anyway, which of the crop of nonentities and oddballs would you want running the country in her place? Rees-Mogg? Boris? Gove?
    52% of people in this country, including a very large % of Labour voters in the North East voted out.

    The 'incompetents and idiots' aren't just in parliament they're also in charge of the EU - which was one of the reasons I voted out,I object to British tax payers money feathering the nests of unelected leeches - and we all know what leeches do

    It seems to me that a large majority of politicians are only interested in looking after No1 - not looking after the interests of the people who elected them. Those people who think Jeremy Corbyn and his Communist/Marxist comrades are the best things since sliced bread need to go and live in countries like Venezuela,it might make them appreciate what we have here - even if(don't tell everyone) we are bankrupt.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •