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Thread: Election Result Predictions?

  1. #31
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ironhead View Post
    Which party was / is he running for? Perhaps voters would like to know what the party stands for?

    <and no, I am not eligible to vote in this upcoming election>
    The person concerned is running for Sinn Fein, and to add insult to injury is the current Lord Mayor of Belfast !

  2. #32
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    Interesting to see YFC are jumping on the let’s look good bandwagon....
    ..
    I can remember YFC County executive meeting in 1973 ....NYFC had hatched a scheme called “Plant a tree in 73”....
    Much the same ambition, I expect as the current scheme........
    After a bit of discussion a voice from the back of the room pronounced...in broad Geordie....”I’ve planted 73,000 trees this year will that count?”

    Taken 46 odd years for the bus to come around but it’s here!
    - and I recall the punch line in the pub afterwards was "buy a saw in `74 "

    & to get back to the topic, wasn`t it 74 when we had to apply for petrol coupons as our left wing bretheren were about to interupt fuel supplies, anomgt other things

  3. #33
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Hmmm
    Would that be the time when UK had to seek emergency loans from the IMF....much as Argentina is doing in present time...

    Nope took a little longer to get there...
    https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/...d-imf-loan.htm

    The above link should be compulsory reading for all voters under an age to know better!

  4. #34
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    Hmmm
    Would that be the time when UK had to seek emergency loans from the IMF....much as Argentina is doing in present time...

    Nope took a little longer to get there...
    https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/...d-imf-loan.htm

    The above link should be compulsory reading for all voters under an age to know better!
    I suppose in those days we did not print money!
    Also strange that North Sea oil came to our rescue. They have just found huge reserves of oil within a mile or so of where I was born. In view of climate change, will they extract it?
    jack caley

  5. #35
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Those were the days when commonly each of the nationalised industries lost a few hundred millions each every year.
    British Steel
    British Rail
    National Coal Board
    Etc Etc

    Posted from “Policy Exchange”

    The record after privatisationAfter privatisation, the thirty-three state-run businesses that had, in 1980, cost the taxpayer over £500 billion a year in losses began, by the mid-90s, to pay over £2.5 billion in taxes to the exchequer. They saw huge improvements in productivity, and businesses and consumers benefitted from lower prices. Domestic gas prices fell by around a quarter, and the price of gas to industrial users fell by almost a half. Electricity prices fell by around 2 to 2.5 per cent a year, and the price of telecoms fell 40 per cent. Water prices rose as the industry, which was properly regulated for first time, replaced its Victorian infrastructure and cleaned Britain’s polluted rivers and beaches.The process of privatisation has had its flaws. Yet most evidence suggests that it has significantly improved efficiency in utilities and transport. Policy objectives have been clarified, and effective regulation has been introduced, which has helped to bring down costs and enable some of the radical structural changes we have seen in industries like telecoms or aviation. People currently cultivating the kind of nostalgia chic that welcomes a return to nationalisation should be careful what they wish for.

  6. #36
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    Those were the days when commonly each of the nationalised industries lost a few hundred millions each every year.
    British Steel
    British Rail
    National Coal Board
    Etc Etc

    Posted from “Policy Exchange”

    The record after privatisationAfter privatisation, the thirty-three state-run businesses that had, in 1980, cost the taxpayer over £500 billion a year in losses began, by the mid-90s, to pay over £2.5 billion in taxes to the exchequer. They saw huge improvements in productivity, and businesses and consumers benefitted from lower prices. Domestic gas prices fell by around a quarter, and the price of gas to industrial users fell by almost a half. Electricity prices fell by around 2 to 2.5 per cent a year, and the price of telecoms fell 40 per cent. Water prices rose as the industry, which was properly regulated for first time, replaced its Victorian infrastructure and cleaned Britain’s polluted rivers and beaches.The process of privatisation has had its flaws. Yet most evidence suggests that it has significantly improved efficiency in utilities and transport. Policy objectives have been clarified, and effective regulation has been introduced, which has helped to bring down costs and enable some of the radical structural changes we have seen in industries like telecoms or aviation. People currently cultivating the kind of nostalgia chic that welcomes a return to nationalisation should be careful what they wish for.
    Any farmer who has had to take his produce to the market and take the price offered can tell you the value of market forces. There is a whole range of society that are not subject to market forces and can neither value their product are accountable for their actions. Right the way through from the local council boss, who can put you in to court if you do not pay his inflated salary, through BBC, and MP,s through to civil servants and DERA bosses, none of whom actually create any wealth, they are merely service providers. Of course many are political appointees.
    Most of them should come in the real world and take a bullock or a pig to market!
    jack caley

  7. #37
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Before the bricks start flying, dear reader, you should know that I'm half a world away, and not eligible to vote!

    But... this makes sense to me.

    https://politics.co.uk/blogs/2019/11...brexit-plan-un

    "
    So one of two things are going to happen. Johnson will either stick to his promise and refuse extension, leading to a trade no-deal, with all the consequences that entails. Or he will break his promise and extend.
    The latter is more likely, and not just because the fact that Johnson makes a promise is pretty firm evidence that he will not deliver it. It's likely because after months of industry lobbying, he is unlikely to hammer the economy in order to maintain an election promise he made for a campaign, now in the distant past, which he already won."

    Taken from :https://politics.co.uk

    Well worth reading. By all sides of the debate.

    JV
    Agtronix - the home of the Weedswiper

  8. #38
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by john maddock View Post
    Before the bricks start flying, dear reader, you should know that I'm half a world away, and not eligible to vote!

    But... this makes sense to me.

    https://politics.co.uk/blogs/2019/11...brexit-plan-un

    "
    So one of two things are going to happen. Johnson will either stick to his promise and refuse extension, leading to a trade no-deal, with all the consequences that entails. Or he will break his promise and extend.
    The latter is more likely, and not just because the fact that Johnson makes a promise is pretty firm evidence that he will not deliver it. It's likely because after months of industry lobbying, he is unlikely to hammer the economy in order to maintain an election promise he made for a campaign, now in the distant past, which he already won."

    Taken from :https://politics.co.uk

    Well worth reading. By all sides of the debate.

    JV
    As I see the argument is it will not be possible to get a trade deal!
    If the U.K. Were to withdraw the no tariff deal, and impose tariffs on German cars, French cars, French wine, Belgian pigmeat etc, and replace these with cheaper American pigmeat and beef, Korean cars etcetc, I think European businessmen would force their politicians to come to their senses.
    Our market is a £65 million deficit!
    jack caley
    it should read it will be possible to get a trade deal, easily.
    Last edited by Jack_Caley; 28-11-19 at 07:24 PM. Reason: Correction

  9. #39
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    Any farmer who has had to take his produce to the market and take the price offered can tell you the value of market forces. There is a whole range of society that are not subject to market forces and can neither value their product are accountable for their actions. Right the way through from the local council boss, who can put you in to court if you do not pay his inflated salary, through BBC, and MP,s through to civil servants and DERA bosses, none of whom actually create any wealth, they are merely service providers. Of course many are political appointees.
    Most of them should come in the real world and take a bullock or a pig to market!
    jack caley
    But then Farmers are protected from market forces.
    Annual dunk of money...just enough to keep most folk ticking along...and ensure a regular plentiful supply of food.

  10. #40
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    But then Farmers are protected from market forces.
    Annual dunk of money...just enough to keep most folk ticking along...and ensure a regular plentiful supply of food.
    Actually, Gee, just for the record, and for people who do not understand the payments system, all farmers do not get an annual dunk of money, and never have! The pig and poultry industries have never had support, they operate in a real market system. Arable beef and sheep systems, yes, especially the sheep farmers who just had to keep underfed numbers of sheep on them there hills.
    Just to put the record straight, there is far too much of people jumping to conclusions nowadays, based on only part of the story, e.g. Grazing animals.
    jack caley.
    PS, the only government moneywe got for pigs was to demolish our pig buildings!

  11. #41
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    Actually, Gee, just for the record, and for people who do not understand the payments system, all farmers do not get an annual dunk of money, and never have! The pig and poultry industries have never had support, they operate in a real market system. Arable beef and sheep systems, yes, especially the sheep farmers who just had to keep underfed numbers of sheep on them there hills.
    Just to put the record straight, there is far too much of people jumping to conclusions nowadays, based on only part of the story, e.g. Grazing animals.
    jack caley.
    PS, the only government moneywe got for pigs was to demolish our pig buildings!
    Yep but where did the cereals come from to feed the pigs?
    Subsidised cereal farmers...

  12. #42
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    Yep but where did the cereals come from to feed the pigs?
    Subsidised cereal farmers...
    I would agree that the cereals were subsidised, however, the most important effect on cereal prices is world cereal commodity prices, presumably these are subject to market pressure! Poultry prices especially are subject to Brazilian and Thai prices.
    jack caley

  13. #43
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Why can't people just understand the "subsidy" myth ? Take the area payments away and U.K. farmers could not afford to grow cereals with the present cost of production. Take the environmental payments away and the sheep, dairy & beef boys would be struggling. So who is being subsidised ? The grower or the consumer ? Within the U.K. there exists a certain standard of food production that is non-existent in certain other places in the World. Now I would ask the public, "where do you want your food produced ? here in the U.K. or in some Latin-American, Asian, Communist or third World country" ?

    Farming is, with the odd exception, a difficult way of making a living. It has it advantages of course and these can't be denied. It's why most of us carry on doing it. When you see the packed public transport, the ghettoes of inner cities, the drug riddled sink holes that exist in the urbam environment, is it any wonder that we are so glad that we can, in the main, walk out of the door in the morning and we are in our wonderful workplace. But make no mistake, take all forms of support away and the place would revert to a landscape of fly tipping, illegal development, and mass trespass and Joe Public would be eating all kinds of imported garbage. Mind you, some of them do that anyway !

    The man on the Clapham omnibus gets a good deal from U.K. farmers and growers. The land is looked after and kept tidy, the wildlife is appreciated and therefore encouraged, and he gets subsidised good food, that by and large, most people can afford. Farmers do not get any subsidy at all, the consumer benefits from any money paid to food producers and so it is they who are subsidised.

  14. #44
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    The man on the Clapham omnibus gets a good deal from U.K. farmers and growers. The land is looked after and kept tidy, the wildlife is appreciated and therefore encouraged, and he gets subsidised good food, that by and large, most people can afford. Farmers do not get any subsidy at all, the consumer benefits from any money paid to food producers and so it is they who are subsidised.
    Spot on....
    Sadly though it has distorted the cost of farming .....every input is vastly overpriced...including land.
    Rather like continuing Blood Transfusions, the single payment keeps the Heart of Farming beating.


  15. #45
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    The man on the Clapham omnibus gets a good deal from U.K. farmers and growers. The land is looked after and kept tidy, the wildlife is appreciated and therefore encouraged, and he gets subsidised good food, that by and large, most people can afford. Farmers do not get any subsidy at all, the consumer benefits from any money paid to food producers and so it is they who are subsidised.
    Spot on....
    Sadly though it has distorted the cost of farming .....every input is vastly overpriced...including land.
    Rather like continuing Blood Transfusions, the single payment keeps the Heart of Farming beating.

    Really, the price of land has got very little to do with its agricultural value, hardly ever has.
    Basically now it is a hedge against inflation, or an escape from capital taxation.
    With regard to arable returns, there. Is a large arable enterprise near here which showed a loss of £1 million, year before last! We lost money three years on the trot before that on arable, and that was with low machinery depreciation costs. Heaven knows what losses some people show on £300000 tractors and combines!
    jack caley

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Well run Farms on a bit of decent land bought and paid for in the past ...currently with no borrowed money whatsoever .
    No rent to pay ...no interest charges..are and will continue to make good profits.
    They are seldom heard of , preferring to keep their heads below the parapet and keep on making good profits.
    Surprising how many there are.

  17. #47
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    Well run Farms on a bit of decent land bought and paid for in the past ...currently with no borrowed money whatsoever .
    No rent to pay ...no interest charges..are and will continue to make good profits.
    They are seldom heard of , preferring to keep their heads below the parapet and keep on making good profits.
    Surprising how many there are.
    There might be a few farms like that in your part of the World Gee but not many down here. But there used to be. One of my Grandfathers bought and sold 5 farms in his lifetime, the first one in 1920, leaving the last one in his will when he died, the other one did the same but with 3 farms. And I once knew a man who tenanted a 45 acre farm with probably another 30 acres of odds & sods rented nearby who milked 20 cows. He hunted 3 days a week and gave his Son a private education. Anyone would struggle to do that today but then all businesses have changed over the years.

  18. #48
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    But then Farmers are protected from market forces.
    Annual dunk of money...just enough to keep most folk ticking along...and ensure a regular plentiful supply of food.
    Just had a thought, Gee, about farmers being protected from market forces.
    I used to come to Hexham to buy store beast. They were good cattle and made good money, from hard sellers.
    Would it be an idea to return to Hexham? If the farmers there do not have to worry about how much their beast make, because they get a big dunk of money from the government, then surely prices will be cheap?
    Then I could do what we used to do, that is draw a fair bit of luck money and have a good steak in York, on the way home.
    Jobs a Godun.
    jack caley
    Last edited by Jack_Caley; 30-11-19 at 12:07 PM. Reason: Correction

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    There might be a few farms like that in your part of the World Gee but not many down here. But there used to be. One of my Grandfathers bought and sold 5 farms in his lifetime, the first one in 1920, leaving the last one in his will when he died, the other one did the same but with 3 farms. And I once knew a man who tenanted a 45 acre farm with probably another 30 acres of odds & sods rented nearby who milked 20 cows. He hunted 3 days a week and gave his Son a private education. Anyone would struggle to do that today but then all businesses have changed over the years.
    As I said ...seldom you hear of them...but they are there.

  20. #50
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    Just had a thought, Gee, about farmers being protected from market forces.
    I used to come to Hexham to buy store beast. They were good cattle and made good money, from hard sellers.
    Would it be an idea to return to Hexham? If the farmers there do not have to worry about how much their beast make, because they get a big dunk of money from the government, then surely prices will be cheap?
    Then I could do what we used to do, that is draw a fair bit of luck money and have a good steak in York, on the way home.
    Jobs a Godun.
    jack caley
    Plenty of your compatriots attend the Hexham store ring, a fair percentage of the decent cattle head down to Yorkshire etc...
    Younger sorts seven months etc are still making silly money...£700ish
    A year older and they can be had between £850 and £1050.....
    Fact is not many of them would be there without the annual dunk of money....pretty sure when you were there the old Green Blue and Red system would be in operation.....Green passports carrying a couple of payments etc....
    £900 @ 18 months gives £1.66 a day to feed and maintain a Suckler Cow , one calf’s share of a bull for a year....then a year or so of keep for the animal itself.
    Remember to allow for the dead ones...a bit of haulage....some auctioneers commission ....some rent...finance charges.....the list goes on!
    Little bit North of Hexham is Wooler.....the used to have a two or three day suckled calf sale.....largely Charolais calves...three or four herds around here would supply more than a thousand or fifteen hundred calves between them....none of those farm produce suckled calves for sale.
    The mart struggles at attract perhaps 500 calves over the entire autumn sale period.
    Nope the Dunk of money keeps the wheels going around.

  21. #51
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    Plenty of your compatriots attend the Hexham store ring, a fair percentage of the decent cattle head down to Yorkshire etc...
    Younger sorts seven months etc are still making silly money...£700ish
    A year older and they can be had between £850 and £1050.....
    Fact is not many of them would be there without the annual dunk of money....pretty sure when you were there the old Green Blue and Red system would be in operation.....Green passports carrying a couple of payments etc....
    £900 @ 18 months gives £1.66 a day to feed and maintain a Suckler Cow , one calf’s share of a bull for a year....then a year or so of keep for the animal itself.
    Remember to allow for the dead ones...a bit of haulage....some auctioneers commission ....some rent...finance charges.....the list goes on!
    Little bit North of Hexham is Wooler.....the used to have a two or three day suckled calf sale.....largely Charolais calves...three or four herds around here would supply more than a thousand or fifteen hundred calves between them....none of those farm produce suckled calves for sale.
    The mart struggles at attract perhaps 500 calves over the entire autumn sale period.
    Nope the Dunk of money keeps the wheels going around.
    You have not got my point!
    Do the producers ignore market forces, and just give them away?
    They still have face market forces to carry, taking in to account the payments on top.
    jack caley

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    There might be a few farms like that in your part of the World Gee but not many down here. But there used to be. One of my Grandfathers bought and sold 5 farms in his lifetime, the first one in 1920, leaving the last one in his will when he died, the other one did the same but with 3 farms. And I once knew a man who tenanted a 45 acre farm with probably another 30 acres of odds & sods rented nearby who milked 20 cows. He hunted 3 days a week and gave his Son a private education. Anyone would struggle to do that today but then all businesses have changed over the years.
    Precisely, he would not be able hunt 3 days a week now!
    Mostly the people who survive now, have either sent the missus out to work, or have diversified.
    We diversified thirty years ago, reference the calamill below!

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    Precisely, he would not be able hunt 3 days a week now!
    Mostly the people who survive now, have either sent the missus out to work, or have diversified.
    We diversified thirty years ago, reference the calamill below!
    All a matter of scale....
    Are you trying to tell me that a capable individual farming say a 1000 acres of decent stuff bought and paid for say fifty years ago, with no borrowed money who is prepared to work cant make some pretty decent profits?
    No borrowed money or rent should mean he can turn a profit without subsidy support.
    Fair enough it would take a smaller acreage in the past to achieve the same level of comfort, but this is now.

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Caley View Post
    Precisely, he would not be able hunt 3 days a week now!
    Correct. For two reasons ( at least)
    1. The local pack was disbanded (years before the ban)
    2. The ban.

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gee View Post
    All a matter of scale....
    Are you trying to tell me that a capable individual farming say a 1000 acres of decent stuff bought and paid for say fifty years ago, with no borrowed money who is prepared to work cant make some pretty decent profits?
    No borrowed money or rent should mean he can turn a profit without subsidy support.
    Fair enough it would take a smaller acreage in the past to achieve the same level of comfort, but this is now.
    My opinion wasn't based on those sorts of figures. But to be more realistic, even with 250-ish acres of decent dirt, which used to be a fair sized farm, would be struggling now, even if it was all bought and paid for, and with no borrowings. I am excluding intensive livestock outfits because I know very little about the economics of that sort of farming.

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    My opinion wasn't based on those sorts of figures. But to be more realistic, even with 250-ish acres of decent dirt, which used to be a fair sized farm, would be struggling now, even if it was all bought and paid for, and with no borrowings. I am excluding intensive livestock outfits because I know very little about the economics of that sort of farming.
    The thousand acre syndrome should never have been allowed, there should at least have been a cap. It has truly distorted agricultural structure anyway, and was not necessary.
    I never believed we should have left production related subsidies. However I think the hierarchy of the NFU were large acreage anyway.
    jack caley

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    It's all about putting 000s on the end of everything now. I know a man who farmed 400 acres 30 years ago. All arable, tenant farmer. Now, he and his three Sons farm 4000 acres. A bit owned, most rented/share/contract farmed. They have grabbed everything they could and are a profitable business. But they are into other things as well, not connected with farming at all. You have to admire their tenacity and ability for sheer hard work but it is such a shame, in my view, that the farms that they now farm are empty. Where there used to be country characters, people who added to the rural community just by their presence, are now gone. The farms are a hive of activity with huge machines at certain times. But then they are dead when they have all moved onto the next block of land.

    The cottages have mostly been sold and have been turned into min-mansions, the outlying barns were turned into dwellings years ago, and now if there is an outlying modern-type farm building even those are gaining planning permission for habitable dwellings. All occupied by people who have no roots in the countryside. Some make an effort - most don't. I used to grow spuds and we picked by hand with the help of local ladies (who would give you some serious stick if you pushed your luck ! ) Towards the end I had to put a notice in a couple of local village shops for pickers and a few kids turned up. They hadn't got a clue about the work ethic and it was this that convinced me that it was time to stop growing tatties !
    Last edited by zaza; 01-12-19 at 11:50 PM.

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    It's all about putting 000s on the end of everything now. I know a man who farmed 400 acres 30 years ago. All arable, tenant farmer. Now, he and his three Sons farm 4000 acres. A bit owned, most rented/share/contract farmed. They have grabbed everything they could and are a profitable business. But they are into other things as well, not connected with farming at all. You have to admire their tenacity and ability for sheer hard work but it is such a shame, in my view, that the farms that they now farm are empty. Where there used to be country characters, people who added to the rural community just by their presence, are now gone. The farms are a hive of activity with huge machines at certain times. But then they are dead when they have all moved onto the next block of land.

    The cottages have mostly been sold and have been turned into min-mansions, the outlying barns were turned into dwellings years ago, and now if there is an outlying modern-type farm building even those are gaining planning permission for habitable dwellings. All occupied by people who have no roots in the countryside. Some make an effort - most don't. I used to grow spuds and we picked by hand with the help of local ladies (who would give you some serious stick if you pushed your luck ! ) Towards the end I had to put a notice in a couple of local village shops for pickers and a few kids turned up. They hadn't got a clue about the work ethic and it was this that convinced me that it was time to stop growing tatties !
    Your first paragraph confirms my view that farmers have to be market and business orientated, otherwise they will not be farmers for long. It used to be 30 tonnes of barley bought a tractor,now it is 300. As margins grow smaller, it is either get bigger or get out. There can be a way out with diversification, also intensifying pigs or chickens, both very risky. On the subject of converting even relatively modern buildings I know of one free range egg producer who is shutting down a very large operation and taking planning conversions, not in East Yorkshire, it is one of the worst to get planning. He says free range eggs are now overproduced, and he is working for nothing. Needs more farmers like him!
    jack caley

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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Yes Jack, but my sadness is that we have lost our rural charm. There is undoubtedly a "charm" of sorts taking it's place but there was a time, when I was a lad ( 14 YO) and had got my hands on my first gun, a double barrelled .410 and a kind local farmer very near to me allowed me to go and shoot over his land. And to get there I would walk through the village with my gun under my arm. Nobody batted an eyelid. That wouldn't happen today although of course there are other reasons why the Police would soon be called.

    But I was on a charlie drive one day with half a dozen mates walking over fields of several farms near the village (all with permission of course) and a recent incomer called the Police because he thought we shouldn't be doing such a thing. This was 15 years ago so nothing to do with any concerns about the problem that we face today. I have a big problem. I want to go back in time and I know I can't. Do we look at the past with rose tinted spectacles ?

  30. #60
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    Re: Election Result Predictions?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaza View Post
    Yes Jack, but my sadness is that we have lost our rural charm. There is undoubtedly a "charm" of sorts taking it's place but there was a time, when I was a lad ( 14 YO) and had got my hands on my first gun, a double barrelled .410 and a kind local farmer very near to me allowed me to go and shoot over his land. And to get there I would walk through the village with my gun under my arm. Nobody batted an eyelid. That wouldn't happen today although of course there are other reasons why the Police would soon be called.

    But I was on a charlie drive one day with half a dozen mates walking over fields of several farms near the village (all with permission of course) and a recent incomer called the Police because he thought we shouldn't be doing such a thing. This was 15 years ago so nothing to do with any concerns about the problem that we face today. I have a big problem. I want to go back in time and I know I can't. Do we look at the past with rose tinted spectacles ?
    We had a chap talking to Beeford discussion group the other day from near Rievaux Abbey. He had written a book called Dunn and Dusted, his name was Dunn. Fascinating book, he is 70 years old, but the book is still back in time. An old time of Probably Methodist church, a hard life of manual work with horses, Herriot country. One photo of a rabbit catcher who caught 110 rabbits in one day! Of course in those days, rabbits were a farmworkers perks, until myxie.
    The book is out of print, but we bought one E bay. Well worth a read, especially if you yearn for the old days.
    jack caley

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