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Thread: 2nd wheat

  1. #1
    wellingtonfarmer1
    Guest

    2nd wheat

    Growing 2nd wheat for 1st time this year any tips on how to get a good yield?

  2. #2
    TexelBurger
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Don't drill too early ,mid oct onwards.
    Use a latitude type dressing.
    Use a zinc type spray autumn and spring for root development.
    Put a bit of early N on .
    Consider adding a bit of strob to the fungicide program.

    That's what we do ,others may have other opinions.

  3. #3
    Col the Ox
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by TexelBurger View Post
    Don't drill too early ,mid oct onwards.
    Use a latitude type dressing.
    Use a zinc type spray autumn and spring for root development.
    Put a bit of early N on .
    Consider adding a bit of strob to the fungicide program.

    That's what we do ,others may have other opinions.

    Agree with most of that. My only questionable point is the use of Latitude. I have only used it once, and that may not be a fair test; but i will never use it again. The wheat was awful, and compared to the other wheat which had not had Latitude, it really did not do well at all. As you say, leave until mid October at the earliest, and consider Jockey or Galmano as a treatment instead of Latitude would be my advice.

  4. #4
    andy26
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    As above,

    +1 don't bother with Latitude, personally I would spend the money you save on extra seed to allow you to put the drilling date back as late as you dare.

    Check the HGCA recommended list to make sure you choose a variety that does well as a 2nd wheat and also suits late drilling.

    In the spring a T1, that targets stem based diseases, e.g. Tracker (1l/ha+) or the addition of Amistar.

  5. #5
    marsh_bor
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    why would lat make it yield worse?

    Good coat of muck

  6. #6
    andy26
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by marsh_bor View Post
    why would lat make it yield worse?
    It wouldn't, but you need quite a strong yield response to pay for the Latitude, even more so given the higher seed rate you should be using for the later 2nd wheat drilling date.

    If you could pay for Latitiude on a per hectare basis it would be more attractive.

    Given the cost of Latitude it can make you cut the seed rate which in itself can cut yield.

  7. #7
    marsh_bor
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    0.2t/ha yield response needed, I thought the only point of lat was to bang it in now, after mid oct cant do much? Ive used lat last two years and v pleased, although could be in the mind.

  8. #8
    dmcmiken
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Why drill as late as possible? For disease? Most of our 2nd wheat is planted now, I just feel we have to take the chance when we get it at this time of year.

  9. #9
    czechmate
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    I use latitude every year and think it pays well for itself.

  10. #10
    yellow belly
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    if you can wait then the need for seed treatment is reduced

    the seed bed needs to be firm too loose and fluffy leads to worse takeall

  11. #11
    Mr Cricket
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by TexelBurger View Post
    Don't drill too early ,mid oct onwards.
    Use a latitude type dressing.
    Use a zinc type spray autumn and spring for root development.
    Put a bit of early N on .
    Consider adding a bit of strob to the fungicide program.

    That's what we do ,others may have other opinions.
    Agree with most, not convinced about zinc though, phosphite can aid rooting, so can early PGR

    Would say 60-80 kg N early (end Feb/early Mar)

    Boscalid + Azoxystrobin gives great results on eyespot and take all reduction (tracker + Amistar Opti a good mix)

  12. #12
    gone up the hill
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by czechmate View Post
    I use latitude every year and think it pays well for itself.
    +1

    2011 harvest i put in a field of 2nd wheat, deter + latitude dressed, drilled mid oct ( dont drill 2nd wheat any earlier than this! ) same variety/sprays/fert etc as 1st wheat and it yielded 4.3t/acre plus 15 roundbales straw/acre, it out yielded first wheats by a mile but this field is heavy ground and the rest was lighter land..

    If Take All spores are in the ground ( and you wont know untill its too late either way ) then expect a yield drop of at least 30%, with the current price of wheat its a no brainer to latitude dress unless your 100% sure its Take All free..

  13. #13
    BigTractor™
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Best Second wheat I ever grew was Claydon drilled in Mid October, Jockey dressed & An early 50 units of N on the 1st of March, 4ton/acre

    B.T

  14. #14
    czechmate
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by gone up the hill View Post
    +1

    2011 harvest i put in a field of 2nd wheat, deter + latitude dressed, drilled mid oct ( dont drill 2nd wheat any earlier than this! ) same variety/sprays/fert etc as 1st wheat and it yielded 4.3t/acre plus 15 roundbales straw/acre, it out yielded first wheats by a mile but this field is heavy ground and the rest was lighter land..

    If Take All spores are in the ground ( and you wont know untill its too late either way ) then expect a yield drop of at least 30%, with the current price of wheat its a no brainer to latitude dress unless your 100% sure its Take All free..

    I think I would start getting twitchy at latitude and deter. In a late drilled second wheat, what is the deter bringing to the party?

  15. #15
    watfordfrosty
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    plough last years stubble down ,plenty off muck
    drill mid october
    increase seedrate (we go from 125kg/ha to 175kg/ha)
    40% off total n on early
    rest off n little and often
    last year second wheat outyielded first wheat by 0.5 t/acre
    lattitude dressing
    weather permitting roll it well

  16. #16
    DM
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by andy26 View Post
    As above,

    +1 don't bother with Latitude, personally I would spend the money you save on extra seed to allow you to put the drilling date back as late as you dare.

    Check the HGCA recommended list to make sure you choose a variety that does well as a 2nd wheat and also suits late drilling.
    I once enquired with my seed merchant about getting some latitude dressed seed.
    His response was not to bother with it unless I was needing to spend extra money in order to keep the tax bill down that year

    Used jockey once when it first came out. Didn't see much benefit from it.

    Agree that varietal choice has a big influence Used to grow Consort in that slot and Istabraq has done really well for me as a second and continuous wheat over the past 5 or 6 years.

  17. #17
    gone up the hill
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by DM View Post
    I once enquired with my seed merchant about getting some latitude dressed seed.
    His response was not to bother with it unless I was needing to spend extra money in order to keep the tax bill down that year

    Used jockey once when it first came out. Didn't see much benefit from it.

    Agree that varietal choice has a big influence Used to grow Consort in that slot and Istabraq has done really well for me as a second and continuous wheat over the past 5 or 6 years.
    Istabrag is my choice of 2ND wheat, as for your seed merchant.... he is talking utter crap, regardless of the pros/cons of treating seed with Latitude it wont in the great scheme of things help your tax bill much ( well might help next years tax bill if you get a 30% yield drop:lolk:

    Adding a latitude dressing will cost you about £20 ish max ( off the top of my head ) but will give you at least 0.85 ton/acre in grain alone so if you spend £20 ish/acre your net gain a acre in grain alone ( at current prices ) will be at least £130/acre = no brainer imo..

  18. #18
    gone up the hill
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by BigTractor™ View Post
    Best Second wheat I ever grew was Claydon drilled in Mid October, Jockey dressed & An early 50 units of N on the 1st of March, 4ton/acre

    B.T
    Best first wheat iv had was 4.5 t/acre so hence this field really shocked me last year when it was cut to say the least!! it was PH/COMBI drilled mid oct and had a good dose of cattle muck and 150 units of N in the spring ( three way split ) it looked crap to say the least going into/coming out of the winter and looked yellow as hell untill the rain came in late May!!

    I always feel/it appears ( rightly or wrongly.. ) that providing you can see the drill rows the worst a field of wheat looks coming out of winter the better it seems to yield

  19. #19
    gone up the hill
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by czechmate View Post
    I think I would start getting twitchy at latitude and deter. In a late drilled second wheat, what is the deter bringing to the party?
    Well it worked on this field.. It was Deter dressed as per the recommendation of my agromist ( no connection to the seed dressing company )

    Not a cheap option by any means i agree!! but basically using Deter helps against slugs/ better crop stand going into winter and the main thing is only had to go in once with a pre em for weeds once drilled and can shut the gate untill spring..

    Im always open to new ideas/saving cash.. what do you do with 2nd wheats and what are your type of soils czechmate??

  20. #20
    czechmate
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by gone up the hill View Post
    Well it worked on this field.. It was Deter dressed as per the recommendation of my agromist ( no connection to the seed dressing company )

    Not a cheap option by any means i agree!! but basically using Deter helps against slugs/ better crop stand going into winter and the main thing is only had to go in once with a pre em for weeds once drilled and can shut the gate untill spring..

    Im always open to new ideas/saving cash.. what do you do with 2nd wheats and what are your type of soils czechmate??

    Farm is all heavy but at least well drained so delaying drilling can be a bit tence. Havnt drilled any cereals so am nervously watching weather forcasts.
    Always Latitude. Due to storage limitations I can only grow one variety, so 2nd are also Solstice. Never drill before 10/10. Ground is Trioed as the straw leaves, carrier and rolled. Left hopefully at least a month. Drilled (SD) and rolled. Early N. Then same regiem as First wheats.
    Second wheats used to be a second rate crop, now, mainly since Latitude, come harvest you cant pick between First and Second.
    Oh, all firsts get Deter - mainly slugs issue after osr.
    I always have a field of barley, eigher in 2nd or 3rd wheat situation. I have never tried Latitude on that. Have you any opinion?

  21. #21
    gone up the hill
    Guest

    Re: 2nd wheat

    Quote Originally Posted by czechmate View Post
    Farm is all heavy but at least well drained so delaying drilling can be a bit tence. Havnt drilled any cereals so am nervously watching weather forcasts.
    Always Latitude. Due to storage limitations I can only grow one variety, so 2nd are also Solstice. Never drill before 10/10. Ground is Trioed as the straw leaves, carrier and rolled. Left hopefully at least a month. Drilled (SD) and rolled. Early N. Then same regiem as First wheats.
    Second wheats used to be a second rate crop, now, mainly since Latitude, come harvest you cant pick between First and Second.
    Oh, all firsts get Deter - mainly slugs issue after osr.
    I always have a field of barley, eigher in 2nd or 3rd wheat situation. I have never tried Latitude on that. Have you any opinion?
    I agree you cant tell the difference between 1st/2nd wheats these days due to Latitude, how early do you go with the N on 2nd wheats? i normally put my first N on mid march if conditions allow, ( thou my agromist reckons not putting any N on heavy ground regardless of 1st/ 2nd wheat untill the 10th of April but imo thats way to late and gets ignored!! )

    I wouldnt bother using Latitude on 2nd/3rd barley, i just go with redigo Deter in that situation, very rare to get Take All in barley..

    I never drill 2nd wheats untill mid oct but try to get all the barley in by the 10th oct ( thou this year that will go out the window as its pissing it down again tonight and not been able to plough any ground ( except for catch crops ) yet..

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