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Thread: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

  1. #91
    Courier
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    I have a 27ft single axle ex road trailer with a ring hitch which we use occasionally (within our ring fence) on the pick up hitch of a DB 780.

    When carting silage bales the combination has been known to not get stuck where a 4wd 5150 pulling a dolly trailer with the same number of bales on it does.

    The 780 would never get out of 2nd gear (6 speed box) though when loaded :lolk:

  2. #92
    JohnDeere8530
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Cowabunga View Post
    Pulling conventional 8 ton silage trailer with a 2wd JD 2140 up steep fields with plenty of grip would have the front wheels in the air, auto hitch and low drawbar or not.

    Even slightly above the rear axle is an extremely dangerous place to pull from as, if the drawbar isn't rigid and strong it will have the tractor rearing up and over onto its arse or worse. Those damned foreigners are idiots and they usually pull wagons with wheels at each corner and near zero weight transfer from the implement.
    trouble is with that setup, you have a short tractor, longish drawbar (ie pivot a long way back from rear axle), a relatively big load and static downweight for a smallish tractor. Shortening the drawbar or adding weight to the front would of alleviated this. By the sounds of it there is far too much unecessary ballast on the rear axle, for size and hp of that tractor ie if you went cultivating with that setup it would be unlikely that you would be to spin those wheels with that load on the rear axle

    Keep the hitch as close to rear axle as possible and keep hitch fairly high up (not above rear axle) as this will help weight transfer from tillage machines etc onto the rear axle. Ballast front accordingly if a short tractor to keep weight on front wheels

  3. #93
    john8210
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by axial1680 View Post
    When I first got my 5288 the 4WD wasn't working, I pulled a 5 leg subsoiler at 16inches deep on heavy land that had never been subsoiled before without any trouble. I think as long as its not really wet its ok, its all about weight and balence, they run massive 2wds in the US that will pull a house down.
    i used to do a fair heap of ploughing up here and our land is bit close to the bone in places, i used to run our 1056 in 2wd to avoid damaging the plough when it came into contact with bedrock. it was no trouble for it with 3 furrows in 2wd

  4. #94
    devils advocate
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Running a 4wd in 2wd is not the same as a 2wd the heavy front axle & treded tyres act as a brake, pretty much why 2wd tractors are more fuel efficent.

    But for heavens sake be sensible of course if you are carting silage off the side of a mountain or pulling sugar beet out of a swamp you want 4wd or tracks.

  5. #95
    Chae
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Would the spool valve trick work on modern tractors? Our 6480 has awful engine braking. Even when in lower gears revs run away.

  6. #96
    40cows
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Would the spool valve trick work on modern tractors? Our 6480 has awful engine braking. Even when in lower gears revs run away.
    Only on closed center.

  7. #97
    Ford4000
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Years ago it has been known for the hydraulic arms to be lowered to the bottom then a chain wrapped around them , then when greater traction was needed the hydraulic arms would b e lifted a bit, the chain would strain against the drawbar putting more weight on the back wheels.

  8. #98
    40cows
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Ford4000 View Post
    Years ago it has been known for the hydraulic arms to be lowered to the bottom then a chain wrapped around them , then when greater traction was needed the hydraulic arms would b e lifted a bit, the chain would strain against the drawbar putting more weight on the back wheels.
    Wow!! so how does that work then?

  9. #99
    john8210
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by 40cows View Post
    Wow!! so how does that work then?
    massey did a special version of this , it had a name but i cant think of it, it went on the arms as said but it had a pivoting arm directly above the drawbar pin so turned with pressure on it. we had one years ago kicking around workshop. always wondered what it was untill grandad told me it came with 165 they had in early 70s , said it worked well. gone scrap now and it would prob av been worth a bob or 2 now :cry:

  10. #100
    multi power
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    or you could do it properly n safe with a massey using pressure control

  11. #101
    Red Bull
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by john8210 View Post
    massey did a special version of this , it had a name but i cant think of it, it went on the arms as said but it had a pivoting arm directly above the drawbar pin so turned with pressure on it. we had one years ago kicking around workshop. always wondered what it was untill grandad told me it came with 165 they had in early 70s , said it worked well. gone scrap now and it would prob av been worth a bob or 2 now :cry:
    Think that was a pressure control coupler, never seen one just heard of them.

    Have used the chain round the link arms though, that can be exciting, bordering on dangerous.....................well actually it's bloody dangerous if you're not carefull.

  12. #102
    Ford4000
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by john8210 View Post
    massey did a special version of this , it had a name but i cant think of it, it went on the arms as said but it had a pivoting arm directly above the drawbar pin so turned with pressure on it. we had one years ago kicking around workshop. always wondered what it was untill grandad told me it came with 165 they had in early 70s , said it worked well. gone scrap now and it would prob av been worth a bob or 2 now :cry:
    I saw a demonstration of this when I was in Ag. collage. Little Massey with a ballast roller going down a bank in perfect control with it on, and sliding down helplessly with it off. Looked a good system.

  13. #103
    BeefBoy
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Ford4000 View Post
    Years ago it has been known for the hydraulic arms to be lowered to the bottom then a chain wrapped around them , then when greater traction was needed the hydraulic arms would b e lifted a bit, the chain would strain against the drawbar putting more weight on the back wheels.
    Have used that in snow as a last resort but I wouldn't recomend it, from a safety point of view.

    MF pressure control was the business, though.

  14. #104
    BeefBoy
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Chae View Post
    Would the spool valve trick work on modern tractors? Our 6480 has awful engine braking. Even when in lower gears revs run away.
    Quote Originally Posted by 40cows View Post
    Only on closed center.
    No, it won't work at all on closed centre systems, only open centre. And I wouldn't get in the habit of using it as routine. The pump won't thank you for it.

  15. #105
    Cowabunga
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by BeefBoy View Post
    No, it won't work at all on closed centre systems, only open centre. And I wouldn't get in the habit of using it as routine. The pump won't thank you for it.
    Quite right. And with big tractors the effect will be marginal and the potential for expensive harm much bigger.

    A Perkins engine 6480 has less engine braking than prior engines because of the valve overlap needed for internal egr. Its the price of relative simplicity in the generation before addblue. You will find that current engines have regained normal engine braking.

    Odd thing is that I never notice the supposed lack of engine braking on my four cylinder version Perkins.

  16. #106
    Courier
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by BeefBoy View Post
    Have used that in snow as a last resort but I wouldn't recomend it, from a safety point of view.

    MF pressure control was the business, though.
    Originally called T.C.U. on David Browns ! !

  17. #107
    Cowabunga
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Courier View Post
    Originally called T.C.U. on David Browns ! !
    What year was it introduced by David Brown?

  18. #108
    Courier
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Cowabunga View Post
    What year was it introduced by David Brown?
    First patented and introduced on the 950 Implematic (1959-1963)and operated by means of a handwheel below the main lift lever

    The Massey version first surfaced with the 135 in 1964 I believe.

  19. #109
    eric_t
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Courier View Post
    First patented and introduced on the 950 Implematic (1959-1963)and operated by means of a handwheel below the main lift lever

    The Massey version first surfaced with the 135 in 1964 I believe.
    David Brown introduced it on the 25's and 30's, the models that followed the Cropmaster, 1955...


  20. #110
    Courier
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by eric_t View Post
    David Brown introduced it on the 25's and 30's, the models that followed the Cropmaster, 1955...

    Actually that makes sense. Massey couldn't introduce Pressure Control until the DB patent had run it's course. .

  21. #111
    superspec
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Pressure control was a great idea that never really took off and was quite misunderstood.
    Does anyone have a David brown version of pressure control coupler, I would be intrestind to see what it was like.

  22. #112
    Ford4000
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Bull View Post
    Think that was a pressure control coupler, never seen one just heard of them.

    Have used the chain round the link arms though, that can be exciting, bordering on dangerous.....................well actually it's bloody dangerous if you're not carefull.
    Quote Originally Posted by BeefBoy View Post
    Have used that in snow as a last resort but I wouldn't recomend it, from a safety point of view.

    MF pressure control was the business, though.
    not that dangerous with a fordson major, unless you had placed a lot of washers on the spring under the seat for more lifting power !
    God,I sound old "I'm nearly 40 dont you know" :lolk:

  23. #113
    joe soapy
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by superspec View Post
    Pressure control was a great idea that never really took off and was quite misunderstood.
    Does anyone have a David brown version of pressure control coupler, I would be intrestind to see what it was like.
    If i remember it right, it was a hoop of pipe mounted on the linkage, with a roller and chain to the drawbar. there was an aftermarket version sold as well, but nothing compared as well to the mf. was a very good help on trailed implements like discs or a drill. allows a much lighter tractor to punch above its weight, same as easing a mounted implement a bit in bad spots.. 4wd and added weights seems to have stopped development of clever aids, at the expense of much increased compaction issues

  24. #114
    pudding
    Guest

    Re: Do we under estimate 2wd tractors


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